No exclusive thread for Hiranandani Upscale OMR project. Thought of creating one so that we can follow the developments, Rental yields, Issues and other topics.

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  • Originally Posted by k11
    I do see value. Primary reson being staggered payments spread across 5 years or more.
    See my numbers. Builder is also taking the risk if you ask me. If construction costs shoot up, buyer gets profit builder loses. Hard to say, what the situation is in five years. Construction costs for a high rise complex can easily hit 5K+ from the current 3.5K. What do you think of my numbers in the earlier post.


    I have already accounted and discounted for staggered payment if the you see above. Also not sure of Hira payment plan but I feel the major delay in most cases happen only after customers have paid almost 85%. Builder is quick in raising floors, plastering etc, by then you would have already paid everything except for other charges.

    Construction cost for high rises at 3.5K IMO is overstated. Except for labour cost all commodities have taken a sever beating for last couple of years. Inspite of that construction cost has been going up. They are operating in pretty healthy margin and with slowdown in sales they may take a beating on margin.

    Hard to say as you said, In case if it goes up then yes break even may be quicker.

    @clairvoyant

    Agree RE should be taken an long term view and may disappoint flippers. That is the reason I have given an 10 years view. Having an longer view than this we need to account for depreciation as well.
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  • Srivat,

    What is your opinion on high rise construction cost and land development.
    I thought 3500 is a good estimate for Hira, considering the amount of work put in.

    Building a 20+ storey tower needs a lot of addtional space, high speed lifts, fire escape provisions, etc.
    Hira's buildings are 30-40 storeys.

    Hira does the construction by themselves, so they might save some money here.
    But their buildings are on par with L&T, SP, etc or atleast closer to it.

    When I say L&T, I do not mean Eden Park which is a cheaper spec one.
    I mean look at DLF Commander's Court. That would be a landmark building in the city.
    Look at the upscale hotels they are building.

    My numbers are 2750 for construction cost. Anything less I do not think is possible.
    750rs for land development - roads, landscaping, etc.
    2750+750=3500rs. It might even be a 250-500rs more.

    All we are doing here is trying to get to a base value here.
    I want to know what others think of costs.
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  • Leave the post ya boreing. Builders rising the floor, market it as lifestyle, and gaining heavy profits. Look at the UDS, Maintainance charge, this is not good for the cost of living
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  • Originally Posted by k11
    Srivat,

    What is your opinion on high rise construction cost and land development.
    I thought 3500 is a good estimate for Hira, considering the amount of work put in.

    Building a 20+ storey tower needs a lot of addtional space, high speed lifts, fire escape provisions, etc.
    Hira's buildings are 30-40 storeys.

    Hira does the construction by themselves, so they might save some money here.
    But their buildings are on par with L&T, SP, etc or atleast closer to it.

    When I say L&T, I do not mean Eden Park which is a cheaper spec one.
    I mean look at DLF Commander's Court. That would be a landmark building in the city.
    Look at the upscale hotels they are building.

    My numbers are 2750 for construction cost. Anything less I do not think is possible.
    750rs for land development - roads, landscaping, etc.
    2750+750=3500rs. It might even be a 250-500rs more.

    All we are doing here is trying to get to a base value here.
    I want to know what others think of costs.


    Let us go with your numbers of 2750. Not seen the plan but lets assume 85% super builtup area. Now for the remaining 15% they are charging the whole cost. Even if they spend 40% of the cost for corridors other in building amenities. 60% of common area * no of apartments is more than sufficient for roads, landscaping etc. If you dig into the details they may have charges like club house membership etc which will suffice equipment and building club house with hefty margins on that as well.

    Not only in Hira with low carpet area across industry we have to pay full sq ft rate on common area where the builder mints huge money.

    @Bala

    The RE scenario in chennai itself has become boring these days. :). Let us not talk about Underbuilding Divided Share again please in this forum.
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  • Originally Posted by srivat
    Let us go with your numbers of 2750. Not seen the plan but lets assume 85% super builtup area. Now for the remaining 15% they are charging the whole cost. Even if they spend 40% of the cost for corridors other in building amenities. 60% of common area * no of apartments is more than sufficient for roads, landscaping etc. If you dig into the details they may have charges like club house membership etc which will suffice equipment and building club house with hefty margins on that as well.

    Not only in Hira with low carpet area across industry we have to pay full sq ft rate on common area where the builder mints huge money.


    Srivat,

    The construction costs include the lobbies, lift, water tank, etc.
    Construction company will not just charge for carpet area.

    Carpet Area 69-72% - Fully charged by const company and builder to consumer.
    Walls - 10-12% - Fully charged by const company and builder to consumer.
    Common Area - 16-18% - Fully charged by builder to consumer.
    Even part of this would be charged by construction company, may be 10% or so.

    The remaining 5-6% will go into gym, club house and other facilties.

    The 1-2L that the builder charges for clubhouse would cover equipments like ACs, pool tables, treadmills, pool cleaning systems, security cameras, etc.
    The basic construction cost and land cost is not recovered by this.
    You can always say Hira might own this and say association does not, it is a grey area so I cannot comment.

    Even if it is excluded it still only about 5-6%, small difference.

    Land development costs like roads, lights, gate, security systems, landcaping, power backup, STP, water treatment, etc would all cost money. So the 750.
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  • Originally Posted by k11
    Srivat,

    The construction costs include the lobbies, lift, water tank, etc.
    Construction company will not just charge for carpet area.

    Carpet Area 69-72% - Fully charged by const company and builder to consumer.
    Walls - 10-12% - Fully charged by const company and builder to consumer.
    Common Area - 16-18% - Fully charged by builder to consumer.
    Even part of this would be charged by construction company, may be 10% or so.

    The remaining 5-6% will go into gym, club house and other facilties.

    The 1-2L that the builder charges for clubhouse would cover equipments like ACs, pool tables, treadmills, pool cleaning systems, security cameras, etc.
    The basic construction cost and land cost is not recovered by this.
    You can always say Hira might own this and say association does not, it is a grey area so I cannot comment.

    Even if it is excluded it still only about 5-6%, small difference.

    Land development costs like roads, lights, gate, security systems, landcaping, power backup, STP, water treatment, etc would all cost money. So the 750.


    I got your point, What I was coming to say is the 750/- additional cost may not be required as non-carpet area does not require construction cost of 2750/-. If you multiply the savings in non-carpet area * no of apartments all the land development cost can be covered.

    Club house 1L * say 2000 houses = 20 crores. See what 20 crores can buy and is the club house one provide worth that much money on top it is open for outside members as well and residents association do not have ownership right.
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  • Srivat,

    20 crores looks big. But a 10,000 sqft gym equipment, toilets, etc, a 10,000 club house TVs ACs furniture, massive pool/cleaning systems/water lines/etc will all cost some money. May be not entire 20C, but it will definitely be above 10C.
    I do agree there will be some impact overall, but for an individual it might not be more than 5% I say.
    Lets not go into ownership as I do not understand it also.

    I still think 3500 might not be way off, even if you assume 95% of 2750 cost and 750 land dev costs will bring it to 3350.
    If you knock off 10% of 2750, 3225 will be the number.
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  • We hunted for almost 2 years for company leased Accomodation in city a flat of 1500-2000 sqft with 3 car slots though we have 2 and 3 BHK flats with single slot But in vain . Could find only few flats with 2 slots but noise and dust pollution at 10 feet height acted as deterent factor.

    99.99% of city flats designed and built by taking the maximum Area utilisation into account with single car slots in general except very few with 2 slots by using 1.5 FSI .

    Here too stilt level concept was seriously adopted by all builders only from 1998 and before that G+3 were there . Some builders like RAMS did not even use the extra floor though permitted for quick construction in 1985-90 in Adyar .



    Originally Posted by k11
    City does have some large apts in Nungambakkam, Alwarpet and some other areas. But not on a high rise.
    I have personally seen a 5600sqft unit on one floor plate. One of my friends in college had a huge home in Adyar.
    Easy to get lost especially when it is on one floor.

    But 8000sqft is just over the top.
    There is no comparison for those.
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  • K11 and Clair,

    Cost of construction varies on various parameters for high rise ( especially in Hira it is unique ) Why other builders in the vicinity do not copy this and offer similar offerings at cheap rate to help the discerning buyers is my constant question consciously? We are let down without choice and Comparison in RE market when we can afford to compare the rates from Pin to Piano in this eBiz environment .

    Unique features ( not comparable as none of the builders offer all 10 as bundle though one or two features offered by some builders )

    1. Deep pile foundation of 4 vertcially and 2 diagonally for raising each pillars with 2 times of depth for required height
    2. Slab of 9" to 12" through FBD
    3. Stilt level elevation of 20 feet as against 10 feet
    4. Double wall concept ( which is not tried by any builders including DLF,SOBHA due to hidden increasing cost in it not only for construction but lead time required to shape up that and it's space )
    5. FE system ( upto 13 floors it is different but for more than 20 or so, it is to be implemented seriously with all recharges and mock drill ) with sprinklers, hooters,smoke detectors at all points with water pipe and drain outlet for car wash anni each area.
    6. Cosly Captive concealed STP through gravity system without any odour rather than open one which deters many buyers nearby
    6. Infra development for sustained use without maintenance hassles for years
    7. Skilled Labour charges for 30 and above floors ( even for residents, it is creating vertigo ,think of the labour who plaster at 300 feet with helmet and safety belt )
    8. Detailed plumbing for FWS,DWS,AC drain outlets, RWHS, individual Control system is different
    9. Common Al Bus bar system for power supply and termination and distribution at floor level for flats in hassle free manner with individual MCB for each point is unique and not seen in my life . This individual MCB needs full length cable without any joints for safety purpose!!
    10. Outside: Plastering with 2 coats of putty,one coat of primer and 2 coats of Paints will get peeled off in 3-4 years in Sea side areas exposing the cement portion to outside but here Corrosion proof weather proof paint mixture paste is applied for 1" over cement plastered area . Paint cost is 10 times of Asian paints . Of course this paint is used by Godrej and Lodhas in Mumbai for high rise
    Inside: Gypsum plastering for 1.5" for crack free surface for ever unlike cement plastering prone for hair cracks


    I do not give any weightage for fittings and floorings as it varies from person to person and replaceable once in 5-10 years depends upon the usage

    The above has detailed cost grilled by TN Govts VAT dept and ST Dept of CE and all details need to be submitted to close the project tower by tower .

    Hence comparing the sale price and costings without having one more builder with similar offerings is very tough IMO.

    Cost of construction is hovering from 1200 onwards for ordinary construction with 30-40 fett height.
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  • Yawn, same thing being said again and again! Discuss something new please.
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  • Before yawning, you must have knocked bed instead of posting . It means you are still awake .

    It is meant for consumption of K11 and Clair.

    Truth always prevails and Drumming always get silenced

    Already Bala asked to stop the boring topic . With that post, one must have slept is my opinion


    Originally Posted by Love4land
    Yawn, same thing being said again and again! Discuss something new please.
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  • Originally Posted by REC2013
    Before yawning, you must have knocked bed instead of posting . It means you are still awake .

    It is meant for consumption of K11 and Clair.

    Truth always prevails and Drumming always get silenced

    Already Bala asked to stop the boring topic . With that post, one must have slept is my opinion




    Hiding my eyes. Did not read the one meant for K11 and Clair. ;)
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  • Originally Posted by srivat


    Hiding my eyes. Did not read the one meant for K11 and Clair. ;)


    You can hide your eyes but you can't close your mind. Any thoughts on mattress hit you - Restoplus? :)
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  • Originally Posted by maverick007
    You can hide your eyes but you can't close your mind. Any thoughts on mattress hit you - Restoplus? :)


    RE is a different play you have to open your eyes wide open on the happenings with the project rather the mind believing the project will get delivered. Basically do your ground work. Nope nothing strikes on the mattress front. :( .

    If you have something please share to bring the thread out of boring mood. This thread has become like an Black Scholes formula which only couple of members are able to solve their own way.
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  • Ravi: Thanks! You had been trying hard to educate folks for a while now- but with pessimism sweeping across the industry; sometimes it can be hard for people to see value.

    This is the third economic recession (missed the bus on first, partial on second) I'm facing and screen-play is becoming all more predictable (like tornado chasers). RE as a tool is all more alluring (not necessarily Hira should be VFM for everyone) and it will not run out of fashion. For investors- who had missed previous booms- if you're convinced and see inherent value- there's opportunity out there, upto individuals to make or break.

    Please do assess the risks honestly; happy investing!
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