Members!!!!

I have been looking to invest in a 2-3 Bhk since a couple of months now and more or less zero-ing on ireo sector 67a project ( although uptown, palm studio and victory valley are still on my radar) ... I request all knowledgable members ( especially the seniors and brokers in disguise of members) to comment upon the pros and cons of the project.

Also, I'd request other members planning to go for the project to get in touch with me, so that, we can look for a deal as a group rather than as multiple single parties .

As a start to the thread, let me list out a few pros and cons.

PROS

- New launch. Very little upfront payment.
- Specifications, better than basic, which are becoming a hallmark of ireo.
- location ( as per first information) looks to be good. Behind sector 67 or say
behind victory valley and PVSN
- other projects of the builder getting handsome appreciation and excellent
speed of all projects as of now ( cash crunch doesn't seem to be affecting the
So called FDI funded , politically funded as per grapevine, builder at all.

CONS

- yet undemarcated sector. Not in master plan 2021.
- builder, although very promising, hasn't delivered anything as yet
- specifications will be more along the lines of uptown ( which is available in
resale at 4800-4900 levels and has better location) and not very luxurious
Like grand arch,victory valley or skyon.
- although pricing is very speculative as of now but if it ends up 5k or more
Will be a disappointment ( like unitech south park).


I hope to hear from the other guys soon ....
;)





MODERATOR's NOTE - This thread was started about 18 months back, when this project was rumored to be getting launched . Due to delay in the launch this thread went into hibernation for some time and it is now alive . Newbies/First time users, please note & do not get misguided by the last year's launch price that stands mentioned . A duplicate thread { which stands closed now } has some updated information . Refer http://www.indianrealestateforum.com...7-a-46911.html .
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  • Hi,
    Just got an email from my broker that Ireo has got the lisc and the rates at at 9400/sqft in Soft Launch...

    Is it worth entering now?
    CommentQuote
  • my pov

    RE market in India is an un-regulated Free market free of subsidies. In a free market, price is at which transactions happen (read resale). Price is the purest form of information (it reflects market information, demand-supply, liquidity etc etc)

    2) Undervalued/Overvalued is a market participants perception based on his assessment of risk and returns potential. Each investor will have his / her own assesment and come to what they feel is the "fair" price at which the market should trade. If this fair price is lower than market they sell if its high they buy.

    3) In context of 2) complaining that "prices are insanely high" is fruitless. According to your assessment price is high, for someone else it might be the fair price. If enough participants feel market price is too high, then market will correct.

    4) Incentive: for investors and builders / contractors is to maximise return and minimize risk.

    Builder tries to pass on the risk of Inflation to Investor. So, investor need to take this additional risk in his assesment. He might conclude that even with this added risk a particular investment is "better" than one without it. So instead of complaining, add it to your risk assessment.

    Builder tried to increase return by launching at higher than market prices. An investor needs to asses how this affects his return potential and add it to his assessment. So no point complaining about it.

    5) Villain? : neither builder / investor is a villain for trying to maximise his return and reducing his risk. What makes people villains are unfair practices = late delivery, change in super area, shoddy construction, not delivering on promises etc and not paying on time for investors

    6) Regulation: Is required to stop unfair paractices, NOT to control price. Price controls can only be put by governments and for social reasons (protecting poor, increase developments etc)

    Complaining about high prices is similar to asking for subsidies. If prices is higher than your fair price assesment do not invest. Complain about mal-practices and unfair practices which distort markets.



    Originally Posted by rushilarora
    Dear Sir,

    Kuch to hei... Shaayad pichley janam ka. Kitna bhi avoid karoon aapko par aap aisaa jaal bicchatey ho ki pakad aur jakad he letey ho...

    Its been a long time I have been loosing interest in IREF because there is nothing new to contribute. Same old story of rates, location, SPR Vs Gcx Vs Dew, Ireo promoters Vs IREO bashers, Builders Lobby Vs Poor citizen's lobby, RE Bull Vs RE Bear, Investor Vs End user, Ethical Vs Unethical, Cash Vs All white, I/Me/Mine Vs Rest of All, crusaders of citizens right Vs supporters of every thing evil.....

    To be honest sir, I have done all this a million times and and dont really see anything new in what you just wrote.... Neither I have anything to write for or against the points raised by you.
    But in all humility would like to draw your attention to the fact please for sometime try and read few posts without the filters of the position that you have taken. It would help us in taking a meaning full discussion forward.

    Now what you just wrote I have not been able to understand the purpose of writing it here. Especially to the points I wanted to communicate.

    Neither I SUPPORT builder lobby as mentioned by Manoj nor I am taking the side of the builder like beautifully explained by you below.

    You yourself have mentioned somewhere that you had made 200%-300% return in plot and forget about you there are many across India/world who would have made multiple times return in Real estate. Then why the money earned by us as Investors is termed as "Mehnat ki Kamai' and what builders are doing is "Chori Ki Kamai". When all of us are making money from the same market and infact our valuations are going up due the high prices brought by these builders then why dosent that income pinch us and why does there rates hurt us.

    There are millions in India, working as a couple or as individual who earn a salary of 30-40k per month and dream of owning a house. But will they ever be able to buy that house. Dont you think we all have contributed in every little way and taking these prices further up. Should they not accuse all of us who have been buying multiple properties and increasing the prices and reducing the inventory in the market?

    If you look from their lense then we are equally wrong as much the builders are. Builders are being termed as Villains because they are charding obscene PLC, Escalation clause , Higher BSP.... Similarly we should also be termed villains for these families for making property go out of reach from their hand.

    Now if someone reads this post and feels that I am supporting Builder lobby then my sympathies for their understanding. But if someone can understand the simple point that by blaming builders for the greed and reason for price inflation is not correct.

    If I ask you to read your own lines in the context of being expressed by lower income group people directed to all of us, then you would understand why I am putting all of us and the builder lobby in the same platform.

    Just replace the highlighted words in place of the preceeding words written by you below...




    Lets stop painting ourselves as Saints and builders as only cause of evil.

    RA.
    CommentQuote
  • Sir,

    Highlighted line below is exactly what I am NOT trying to do. But I can summarize what I am trying to say as below :-

    1. Greed is common to all.
    2. Purpose of every business/investment is to maximize profit.
    3. RE is purely another asset class where the price is a function of demand and supply. Since Land is always scarce, its owner will always sell the next patch at higher price.
    4. Will discover new ways in extracting more bang for their bucks.
    5. IREO, EMMAR, DLF, UNITECH are all in same business hence they will point retort to point #2
    6. To expect public service/charity from them is immaturity.
    7. Their approach to attain point #2 will be different but end goal is same.
    8. Point # 7 is true for every other business .
    9. Approach for point # 7 creates differentiation.
    10. Point number 9 creates the premium.
    11. Premium payable is determined by the buyer and Premium Demand is set by seller.
    12.Its not necessary Premium demanded is actually paid for.
    12. This reflects in the difference between Company price and resale price.
    13. However in the long run resale price tend to catch up with the Co price.
    14. Nothing new in what I just wrote, or you wrote.
    15. Hence lets rest this discussion here and enjoy the journey.


    RA.

    PS : Please read my first line again.

    Originally Posted by MANOJa
    I have 2 things to say here -



    1 ) Yes, Investors r greedy, but the Builders r the much bigger devil here . By equating the greed of the Builders with that of the Investors, one cannot shift the blame or maybe, ask Investors to share the blame in equal proportion .

    2 ) Yes, Investors r part of this whole system & they help in feeding the growth of this evil, but as i said, u r looking to equate 2 different segments/ two different greed's / two different motives & objectives . It is like saying that a man who steals a loaf of bread to feed his family & the Person who hoards all the food in the world ( to later sell in the black market ) r thief's & both need to be hanged .



    No body is a saint here & whoever is looking to paint Investors /Builders as Saints is living in a fools paradise, but there is no point in equating them . Both of them thrive because of each other & because of the corrupt system .


    CommentQuote
  • Where did you get this figure from? Does this include PLC? The soft launch rate was 8750. are you talking about the launch rate?

    Originally Posted by youthere
    Hi,
    Just got an email from my broker that Ireo has got the lisc and the rates at at 9400/sqft in Soft Launch...

    Is it worth entering now?
    CommentQuote
  • there are so many sub-8000/ sft projects along GCE ROAD.... i think those are worth it, rather than this... this is just ireo trying to squeeze everything it got... however, as proved by DLF, Unitech, etc, there is a limit to which you can keep jacking up prices... my POV ... only thing is that the payments will just start here, whereas other projects, a larger amount has already gone in... so if ur a satta player (gambler), go for it... from an end-use or long term point of view, i would suggest other, more reasonably priced projects.
    CommentQuote
  • that looks like middle floor and central green facing unit seems good .

    which tower is it ?
    CommentQuote
  • Guptaji,

    Today is turning out to be a very interesting day. How is it possible we were both writing same thoughts in two different posts at the same time. Read post # 971 ...

    Its looking like Guptaji and Aroraji ki jugalbandi...

    Completely in sync with what you WROTE and explained it in much better way.

    Thanks

    RA.

    Originally Posted by ajgupta18
    my pov

    RE market in India is an un-regulated Free market free of subsidies. In a free market, price is at which transactions happen (read resale). Price is the purest form of information (it reflects market information, demand-supply, liquidity etc etc)

    2) Undervalued/Overvalued is a market participants perception based on his assessment of risk and returns potential. Each investor will have his / her own assesment and come to what they feel is the "fair" price at which the market should trade. If this fair price is lower than market they sell if its high they buy.

    3) In context of 2) complaining that "prices are insanely high" is fruitless. According to your assessment price is high, for someone else it might be the fair price. If enough participants feel market price is too high, then market will correct.

    4) Incentive: for investors and builders / contractors is to maximise return and minimize risk.

    Builder tries to pass on the risk of Inflation to Investor. So, investor need to take this additional risk in his assesment. He might conclude that even with this added risk a particular investment is "better" than one without it. So instead of complaining, add it to your risk assessment.

    Builder tried to increase return by launching at higher than market prices. An investor needs to asses how this affects his return potential and add it to his assessment. So no point complaining about it.

    5) Villain? : neither builder / investor is a villain for trying to maximise his return and reducing his risk. What makes people villains are unfair practices = late delivery, change in super area, shoddy construction, not delivering on promises etc and not paying on time for investors

    6) Regulation: Is required to stop unfair paractices, NOT to control price. Price controls can only be put by governments and for social reasons (protecting poor, increase developments etc)

    Complaining about high prices is similar to asking for subsidies. If prices is higher than your fair price assesment do not invest. Complain about mal-practices and unfair practices which distort markets.
    CommentQuote
  • rushil-ji jugalbandi indeed! ...i totally agree with your thoughts...

    i have been looking at gurgaon RE for a couple of months only and try to implement what i learnt in Finance 101 class :D

    Its great to share opinons with people have years on experience in the
    market, so love IREF for that :)


    Originally Posted by rushilarora
    Guptaji,

    Today is turning out to be a very interesting day. How is it possible we were both writing same thoughts in two different posts at the same time. Read post # 971 ...

    Its looking like Guptaji and Aroraji ki jugalbandi...

    Completely in sync with what you WROTE and explained it in much better way.

    Thanks

    RA.
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by amitgargi
    this discussion reminds me one of my colleagues-

    He wanted to buy something in 2010 for 50 lakh , did not buy it due to his low risk taking capacity.. again tried in 2011 , did not buy it.. did try in 2012 but could not afford to buy it.. again tried in 2013 this time everything was out of his scope, he tried to buy in bhiwadi, but was not convinced to buy in bhiwadi..

    toh woh bola --

    "pura gurgoan ka satyanash kar diya greedy logon ne.. main toh mere home town (some rural area in haryana) main plot lunga.. mere plot ki value 3 times ho jayengi and gurgoan market dub jayengi tab main gurgoan main 2 flat lunga..

    iss kahte hian khisyana billi..

    what I want to say is.. everyone is looking to make money. and this money flow is not due to person earning capacity.. some land get sold in rural areas (read this agriculture land) and people buy 2-3 flats in gurgaon.. hence one more investor is born

    so people who own more than one house are also not as much as gulity as builders.. rationalale is now builders have become smart and they know how to make more money hence transfer charges are increased..

    this money will keep flowing form rual areas to main hub and will keep increasing the rates... everyone is trying to justify the rates.. it is part of bussiness.. I am a bussiness man and always would like to multiply my money... if i am seeing a potential in RE, i will put the money in.. hence no one is greedy and every one is greedy..

    everyone tries to multiply money by some way or other.. earlier it was due to money given on interest, now people put same money in property..

    i would give a simple example of axis bank new advertisement where one customer effects life of so many enterprenaurs /shop keeper/ servents .. because it is a chain.
    one end user will create atleast 3 transactions in RE.. hence there will be no shortage of customer.. people aspirations will keep driving it..

    person having 2 bhk will always aspire for 3 bhk, 3bhk for 4 bhk.. one aspiration creates 2 potential customer in market.. bad part is that it will make sure that richer get more richer and poor get more poorer..

    one thing, i too do not endorse Vilains tag.. ram and ravan both are within us..jiska palda bhari wohi feature takes a privleage.. so famous poem make sense..

    har kisi ke andar hain ram and ravan.. main aur ram kaha se lao..

    kisi ko sach main dikkat hian toh stop comming on IREF and stop talking about RE market.. this has been a trend acroos globe in emerging economies. and it will not be going to change..


    Law of gravity is applicable in every scenario.

    In ever Bull run ; these voices are heard
    "this time it is different"

    In this very Gurgaon market; some of the over-leveraged Guys have even committed suicide.

    Resale market in Gurgaon is almost dead.
    I am aware of plot market in towns of Haryana which is also dead.
    Delhi market is dead.

    Let us see how long this euphoria of new launches last.
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by ajgupta18
    my pov

    RE market in India is an un-regulated Free market free of subsidies. In a free market, price is at which transactions happen (read resale). Price is the purest form of information (it reflects market information, demand-supply, liquidity etc etc)

    2) Undervalued/Overvalued is a market participants perception based on his assessment of risk and returns potential. Each investor will have his / her own assesment and come to what they feel is the "fair" price at which the market should trade. If this fair price is lower than market they sell if its high they buy.

    3) In context of 2) complaining that "prices are insanely high" is fruitless. According to your assessment price is high, for someone else it might be the fair price. If enough participants feel market price is too high, then market will correct.

    4) Incentive: for investors and builders / contractors is to maximise return and minimize risk.

    Builder tries to pass on the risk of Inflation to Investor. So, investor need to take this additional risk in his assesment. He might conclude that even with this added risk a particular investment is "better" than one without it. So instead of complaining, add it to your risk assessment.

    Builder tried to increase return by launching at higher than market prices. An investor needs to asses how this affects his return potential and add it to his assessment. So no point complaining about it.

    5) Villain? : neither builder / investor is a villain for trying to maximise his return and reducing his risk. What makes people villains are unfair practices = late delivery, change in super area, shoddy construction, not delivering on promises etc and not paying on time for investors

    6) Regulation: Is required to stop unfair paractices, NOT to control price. Price controls can only be put by governments and for social reasons (protecting poor, increase developments etc)

    Complaining about high prices is similar to asking for subsidies. If prices is higher than your fair price assesment do not invest. Complain about mal-practices and unfair practices which distort markets.


    Real estate market in India is one of the most opaque market.

    It is the worst example of License Permit Raj.

    There are huge entry barriers of Power and influence .

    There is no way to gauge the actual rates at which sales happen.
    Even in fresh launch; underwriters buy cheap.

    It is cartel and oligopoly of Builders with backing of politicians because of which they get away with things which are out right illegal.

    And People who think that Indian Real estate is an example of free economy need some basic lessons in Economics.
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by abc111
    Law of gravity is applicable in every scenario.

    In ever Bull run ; these voices are heard
    "this time it is different"

    In this very Gurgaon market; some of the over-leveraged Guys have even committed suicide.

    Resale market in Gurgaon is almost dead.
    I am aware of plot market in towns of Haryana which is also dead.
    Delhi market is dead.

    Let us see how long this euphoria of new launches start.


    Thanks for correcting.. seems I am in different world.. God bless those over-leveraged Guys :(..
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by abc111
    Real estate market in India is one of the most opaque market.

    It is the worst example of License Permit Raj.

    There are huge entry barriers of Power and influence needed.

    There is no way to gauge the actual rates at which sales happen.
    Even in fresh launch; underwriters buy cheap.

    It is cartel and oligopoly of Builders because of which they get away with things which are out right illegal.

    And People who think that Indian Real estate is an example of free economy need some basic lessons in Economics.

    Anyone interested in tuitions????


    yaar tension ho jati hian itne serious words dekh kar
    License Permit Raj

    main lunga tuitions, PM me your details, will come down to take classes..
    I really need to understand that you said - resale market is dead, plot sale is dead , sale in remote areas is dead (haryana)... still you have got ample time to put efforts on IREF.. I am pretty sure either you have not invested anywhere now or you have some secret formula for investment.. since If you make some money , you will be contradicting yourself.. I must say that you must have something in you that you keep on contracdicting other people thoughts and have enough guts so must be a special person..

    Let me know brother, will be most happy to get knowledge from you..
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by amitgargi
    Thanks for correcting.. seems I am in different world.. God bless those over-leveraged Guys :(..


    Such incidents happened in 2008-09 and before that in 1998-99.
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by amitgargi
    yaar tension ho jati hian itne serious words dekh kar
    License Permit Raj

    main lunga tuitions, PM me your details, will come down to take classes..
    I really need to understand that you said - resale market is dead, plot sale is dead , sale in remote areas is dead (haryana)... still you have got ample time to put efforts on IREF.. I am pretty sure either you have not invested anywhere now or you have some secret formula for investment.. since If you make some money , you will be contradicting yourself.. I must say that you must have something in you that you keep on contracdicting other people thoughts and have enough guts so must be a special person..

    Let me know brother, will be most happy to get knowledge from you..


    By dead I meant highly illiquid market with few transactions occurring.

    A market devoid of much activity.
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by rushilarora
    Sir,

    Highlighted line below is exactly what I am NOT trying to do. But I can summarize what I am trying to say as below :-

    ....................
    15. Hence lets rest this discussion here and enjoy the journey.


    RA.

    PS : Please read my first line again.





    I agree, both of us r more or less saying the same thing, maybe expressing it in our own little ways ( peculiar to most, if not all individuals ) .
    CommentQuote