In yesterday's Forbes India edition, I had a very peculiar finding in an article. The article was about Noida's builders, and whatever is quoted in Forbes cannot be taken lightly, their sources are always with substance. Following is the link, and quote I am referring to:

"However, developers like Amrapali and Supertec insist that things are in control. They talk of bringing in ‘pre-cast’ technology, which basically involves bringing readymade walls and pillars to be assembled at the construction site. Developers say this technology will allow them to work at almost three times the current pace."

Read more: Forbes India - Noida’s New Landlords

Can some members here with the Engineering background please throw some light on the following:

What ‘pre-cast’ technology are they referring to? As far as I know, this precast technology is used in building bridges, flyovers etc. Never heard in residential building constructions. Please correct me if I am wrong.

Amrapali, Supertech are building 20+ floor residential buildings. Can the 20 story pillars be made "precast", even in parts and assembled later? Can such a structure be supported?

Secondly, about the walls, I know precast walls are used in Western countries. They are not brick and cemented walls. Rather they are sheet rock walls supported by wooden and aluminium frames. Is it possible to precast a brick and cemented wall and move and assemble it on 20 floors of the building? I believe it is impossible! Please correct me if I am wrong.

If they plan a building with the sheet rock construction, the very design of the building should be different. No one in India would ever buy or live in a cheap sheet rock constructed flat. That would also mean no concrete floor bases, but different materials for the floors bases also.

In all the construction photographs of the lower floors and basements, I am not seeing any sheet rock construction till now and only brick walls and pillars being strenghthened and progressed by the lenters afresh, and which will take its own time to construct.

I really need to know what these Supertech and Amrapali guys are talking about witht the Forbes. It would be very reckless to talk in air without the substance with Forbes, that would only show their desperation to hide the soar truth.

I already think there are 50% chances of failure in their projects, and if someone confirms to me that what they are talking is just nonsense, then I would escalate their failure chances from 50 to 75%.

Please comment.
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  • I am not an expert, but let me share my own experience.

    As you rightly pointed out, Forbes reporter are better but still they are just reporter... so they don't understand fully but keep on writing.

    Walls, even an entire room can be pre-casted and can be moved and used in a construction site. Generally, pillars are not precasted as those are load bearing. So, generally the pillar structure are casted at the site and completely built in rooms are added in each floor and glued(I mean cemented) to the pillars.

    It is indeed too fast, outer wall can be painted directly and the inner wall can be POP directly, without the usual cement plastering then POP.

    Give me some time, I will be able to post some pictures of this engineering marvel.

    Those concerned with safety or strength be assured that strength of multi-storied building comes from pillars. Walls are not truly load bearing elements.

    The above is from technology perspective ... whether Amrapali or Supertech can do that??

    I dare not to comment on that!!!
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  • Yes, it is possible to precast concrete wall and move to 20+ floors. I have seen these construction in Singapore, building stands very fast, 35 floors in 1 year. Its possible, almost all new development in Singapore is following this methods. So, all walls will precast in off site location and moved up by cranes. There is no brick in walls, its all concrete. Finishing will be excellent this way as it needs very less plastering.



    Originally Posted by vkumar1
    In yesterday's Forbes India edition, I had a very peculiar finding in an article. The article was about Noida's builders, and whatever is quoted in Forbes cannot be taken lightly, their sources are always with substance. Following is the link, and quote I am referring to:

    "However, developers like Amrapali and Supertec insist that things are in control. They talk of bringing in ‘pre-cast’ technology, which basically involves bringing readymade walls and pillars to be assembled at the construction site. Developers say this technology will allow them to work at almost three times the current pace."

    Read more: Forbes India - Noida’s New Landlords

    Can some members here with the Engineering background please throw some light on the following:

    What ‘pre-cast’ technology are they referring to? As far as I know, this precast technology is used in building bridges, flyovers etc. Never heard in residential building constructions. Please correct me if I am wrong.

    Amrapali, Supertech are building 20+ floor residential buildings. Can the 20 story pillars be made "precast", even in parts and assembled later? Can such a structure be supported?

    Secondly, about the walls, I know precast walls are used in Western countries. They are not brick and cemented walls. Rather they are sheet rock walls supported by wooden and aluminium frames. Is it possible to precast a brick and cemented wall and move and assemble it on 20 floors of the building? I believe it is impossible! Please correct me if I am wrong.

    If they plan a building with the sheet rock construction, the very design of the building should be different. No one in India would ever buy or live in a cheap sheet rock constructed flat. That would also mean no concrete floor bases, but different materials for the floors bases also.

    In all the construction photographs of the lower floors and basements, I am not seeing any sheet rock construction till now and only brick walls and pillars being strenghthened and progressed by the lenters afresh, and which will take its own time to construct.

    I really need to know what these Supertech and Amrapali guys are talking about witht the Forbes. It would be very reckless to talk in air without the substance with Forbes, that would only show their desperation to hide the soar truth.

    I already think there are 50% chances of failure in their projects, and if someone confirms to me that what they are talking is just nonsense, then I would escalate their failure chances from 50 to 75%.

    Please comment.
    CommentQuote
  • On a lighter note - Haathi ke daant dikane ke aur khaane ke aur...

    These small time builders have just found limelight in the last 2 years and Forbes comes to talk to them, what can they brag about?? We all know how much timely possession these builders give/can give...
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  • Originally Posted by ondabhai
    I am not an expert, but let me share my own experience.

    As you rightly pointed out, Forbes reporter are better but still they are just reporter... so they don't understand fully but keep on writing.

    Walls, even an entire room can be pre-casted and can be moved and used in a construction site. Generally, pillars are not precasted as those are load bearing. So, generally the pillar structure are casted at the site and completely built in rooms are added in each floor and glued(I mean cemented) to the pillars.

    It is indeed too fast, outer wall can be painted directly and the inner wall can be POP directly, without the usual cement plastering then POP.

    Give me some time, I will be able to post some pictures of this engineering marvel.

    Those concerned with safety or strength be assured that strength of multi-storied building comes from pillars. Walls are not truly load bearing elements.

    The above is from technology perspective ... whether Amrapali or Supertech can do that??

    I dare not to comment on that!!!


    Good information g.harondabhai, In discovery channel I have seen to construct few rooms very rapidly using such technologies, but again such technology are not cheap at all because the main concept of this is the increase normal brick size 20 to 80 times (just like the shape of cement road tiles) , but such bricks are made totally by cement & concrete and hence it becomes at least 2 times costly then using ordinary bricks. These technology are cheap in abroad because their labors are very costly compared to Indian Vihari labors (100 - 150 rupees per day). But for India where one labor can construct 8x5 fit wall in 1 day then any ready made walls which is fully constructed by cement & concrete and purchased by any outside company will cost a lot.

    Now question is also that in NE where flats are being sold any where between 1600 to 2000 PSF can have such margin to use more costly technologies for rapid work? is builders really want to deliver flats ASAP to end users, or just a marketing tricks? Such technologies are not very new , so why any of the builder not used such things previously when they delay projects even by 2-4 years some times.
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  • Thanks ranjeetks, g.harondabhai, nks.nishant and Saurabh. Things are looking more clear from your comments now. I really don't see Amrapali and Supertech ever spending 2x the money to do something like that. Not in their specifications also. They look to me to be talking in air only.
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  • Amrapali and supertech Both are equally average to Bad. I have been in Amrapali green in Indrapuram and can say so sure of that.
    Name any delivered project by these two builders which is average to Good. I am saying Average to bad rather I should have said Bad to worst.
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  • Precast pillars - have nvr heard abt it, maybe amarpali and supertech can do sm R&D over next 10 years and come up with the same.

    Readymade walls - yes, i have even seen this technique being used in a construction but the cost is too high as very high quality material is used for such construction and BIG BIG & hi-tech machinery , skilled labour is required.
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  • Originally Posted by vkumar1
    Thanks ranjeetks, g.harondabhai, nks.nishant and Saurabh. Things are looking more clear from your comments now. I really don't see Amrapali and Supertech ever spending 2x the money to do something like that. Not in their specifications also. They look to me to be talking in air only.

    Well, observing the pace of construction happening around the country and with proper application of NREGA countrywide ,there is bound to be acute shortage of labourers.
    Now , the only option left is adopting some different technology.
    If they are actually planning for precast structures then it is the need of the hour.
    Or else bulidings like Northern eye will take 10 years to come up.
    Precast walls are being used frequently in upcoming structures in many parts of the country ....but for structural integrity pillars are always cast by traditional methods due to earth quake norms....
    But .foriegn experts will have to be hired initially due to paucity of spets.End of the day it is a question of economics and profits..
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  • Originally Posted by cookie
    Name any delivered project by these two builders which is average to Good. I am saying Average to bad rather I should have said Bad to worst.


    Originally Posted by chirag999
    Precast pillars - have nvr heard abt it, maybe amarpali and supertech can do sm R&D over next 10 years and come up with the same.
    Readymade walls - yes, i have even seen this technique being used in a construction but the cost is too high as very high quality material is used for such construction and BIG BIG & hi-tech machinery , skilled labour is required.


    Originally Posted by loneranger
    Or else bulidings like Northern eye will take 10 years to come up.
    Precast walls are being used frequently in upcoming structures in many parts of the country ....but for structural integrity pillars are always cast by traditional methods due to earth quake norms....
    But .foriegn experts will have to be hired initially due to paucity of spets.End of the day it is a question of economics and profits..


    Thanks all for your inputs. Just looks like builders are talking in air. It is clear - For pillars: the technology doesn't exist. For walls: Technology is there but at least 3-4 times more expensive - not likely to be adopted by them.
    With those nonsense talks in view, there chances of failure looks like 75%.
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  • Originally Posted by vkumar1
    Thanks all for your inputs. Just looks like builders are talking in air. It is clear - For pillars: the technology doesn't exist. For walls: Technology is there but at least 3-4 times more expensive - not likely to be adopted by them.
    With those nonsense talks in view, there chances of failure looks like 75%.


    Hi All,
    I'm no expert at this but what I know is precast columns (pillars) do exist and are being used at many construction sites (again not sure if it's being used in India). I think we can check with our respective builders.
    But I have no knowledge as to whether this technology is costly or not.
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  • I have been to the site of DLF Capital Greens, Moti Nagar, Delhi a few times in last 5-6 months. Every time I ask the company sales people in the site office about the slow speed of construction, they tell me that the company is going to use pre-cast structures to speed up the construction in near future. So far the construction is being done in conventional style, which means normal brick walls and normal pillars.

    Point is that the builder is aware that the project was launched well over 2 years ago and the pace at which construction is being done, it will take another 3-4 years to complete the construction of phase-1 and 2.

    So, I believe that the talk about using pre-cast parts to speed up the construction is just to make belive the customer that the project will be delivered on time when the project is delayed by many many years.
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  • Interesting discussion & topic .

    R there any architects/civil engineers around, who can enlighten us here .

    Btw, i don't think Amarpali and Supertech have done any path breaking work in the past ( correct me, if i am wrong here ) & may be willing to adopt latest technologies viz. the cost factor of any of the latest & not so common, methods of construction .


    Originally Posted by ranjeetks
    Yes, it is possible to precast concrete wall and move to 20+ floors. I have seen these construction in Singapore, building stands very fast, 35 floors in 1 year. Its possible, almost all new development in Singapore is following this methods. So, all walls will precast in off site location and moved up by cranes. There is no brick in walls, its all concrete. Finishing will be excellent this way as it needs very less plastering.
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  • Aluminum formwork also known as preformed aluminum concrete structure are used in many countries to speed up the construction. See the following video for a demo of the technology:

    YouTube - ‪Aluminum Formwork‬‏

    If you see the brochures of ireo victory valley Gurgaon, they have mentioned that this technology will be used in their project. That is the only project in Delhi/NCR where this technology may be used.

    Besides the significant time savings, other advantage is that the walls in buildings are very smooth and don't need any plaster. Plastic pipes for electric cables, box for fixing electric switches, water supply pipes and drainage pipes are inserted in the mould itself. So there is no time wasted in putting those pipes in place.

    I doubt Supertech or Amrapali will use this technology because of the bargain basement prices of their flats in NE.
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  • Here how the casting is done at off-site and assembled at construction site
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