What do you guys think about Jaypee Greens Wishtown - NOIDA? Is this a good time to buy? Is Wishtown a good investment?

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  • Originally Posted by trialsurvey
    dinesh bhai can u please confirm if 850 sq ft has now become 940 sq ft in kosmos??
    bhai aap hee ki baat pe bharosa hai humein .. u never say things without having concrete proof :)


    TS bhai - concrete proof to nahin (as that will be in the form of the final offer for possession that JP will issue to you) - but I have reasons to believe that it is indeed the case.

    As I understand, increasing built up area (without carpet area increase) is a firm decision that has been taken at the top levels of JP

    I really think it sucks - but I 'knew' it was bound to happen, 80% builders do it - even Jaypee did it in GN. I just thought JP will take a leaf out of 3C and not do it here (considering all the delays) but obviously they did not bother.

    So - your BSP (white only) will be impacted. Including Service Tax

    Your EDC/IDC and maintenance advance which is on a PSF basis will be increased.

    Your registry will be done on a higher rate.

    Probably what is the worst is your rate of monthly maintenance will be increased month on month forever.

    Sorry if I am adding to the bad news - but this is the full impact.

    I dont want to find any silver linings - as none truly exist (only in some very bullish scenarios they do - but not worth thinking about that at the moment)
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  • Originally Posted by dineshsays
    TS bhai - concrete proof to nahin (as that will be in the form of the final offer for possession that JP will issue to you) - but I have reasons to believe that it is indeed the case.

    As I understand, increasing built up area (without carpet area increase) is a firm decision that has been taken at the top levels of JP

    I really think it sucks - but I 'knew' it was bound to happen, 80% builders do it - even Jaypee did it in GN. I just thought JP will take a leaf out of 3C and not do it here (considering all the delays) but obviously they did not bother.

    So - your BSP (white only) will be impacted. Including Service Tax

    Your EDC/IDC and maintenance advance which is on a PSF basis will be increased.

    Your registry will be done on a higher rate.

    Probably what is the worst is your rate of monthly maintenance will be increased month on month forever.

    Sorry if I am adding to the bad news - but this is the full impact.

    I dont want to find any silver linings - as none truly exist (only in some very bullish scenarios they do - but not worth thinking about that at the moment)


    Dinesh bro....any possibility of Jaypee products getting into conspicuous products category and its demand increasing along with price increase....after all luxury is always expensive isn't it?

    certain products are not meant for the value seeking customer....are they looking at that kind of positioning for Jaypee and narrowing their customer base or are they simple greedy local builder?

    Are they so bullish on the Wish Town that they think it still has huge potential for growth and is currently undervalued.....may be so or may not?

    Some of the above questions come to my mind...so shared...cheers
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  • Originally Posted by orchardman
    Dinesh bro....any possibility of Jaypee products getting into conspicuous products category and its demand increasing along with price increase....after all luxury is always expensive isn't it?

    certain products are not meant for the value seeking customer....are they looking at that kind of positioning for Jaypee and narrowing their customer base or are they simple greedy local builder?

    Are they so bullish on the Wish Town that they think it still has huge potential for growth and is currently undervalued.....may be so or may not?

    Some of the above questions come to my mind...so shared...cheers



    Orchardman, not everything is luxury in WT, it has Kosmos and classic too. Luxury is whats trading 10K+ today. Taking this fact, even the household support should be charged a premium. Bottled water sold in WT should only be Evian. Restaurants/Clubs in WT should add Caviar in each dish they serve.
    And maid should be paid double of what the maids in sector 100,110,137 would be paid...after all they would be working in Wishtown. So how can WT residents see their maids taking regular salary?
    Right?
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  • tho directed at Dinesh, still replying as you wud hv PM him otherwise..

    1. demand increase, price increase as a result - NO. not happening in NCR RE in general these days. dont think JP will be having different trend after this super area increase for all the WT projects (affordable kosmos to watever thr high end offering)
    2. customer base shud hv been narrowed earlier. not after selling most of the inventory
    3. undervalued - buyers dont think so, hence unsold investory. if it is so then shud hv let the benefit go to investors/end users who hv suffered delays and in most cases hvnt got expected profit

    RE might not give huge returns for some tm now and on top of tht JP is using such tactics.
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  • Originally Posted by ankur.jain83
    Orchardman, not everything is luxury in WT, it has Kosmos and classic too. Luxury is whats trading 10K+ today. Taking this fact, even the household support should be charged a premium. Bottled water sold in WT should only be Evian. Restaurants/Clubs in WT should add Caviar in each dish they serve. Right?


    I dont know just a thought so shared......one thing is sure that Jaypee will charge higher for every element of their project.... whether is justified or not cant say right now.......example: parking rates of Emporio Mall, Select City Mall, DLF Saket and MGF Saket mall are different...cant understand why....but we still pay?

    only future demand and supply will tell how it unfolds? Anyways I never understood real estate pricing.....which still remains the most illogical subject for me.
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  • Originally Posted by orchardman
    Dinesh bro....any possibility of Jaypee products getting into conspicuous products category and its demand increasing along with price increase....after all luxury is always expensive isn't it?

    certain products are not meant for the value seeking customer....are they looking at that kind of positioning for Jaypee and narrowing their customer base or are they simple greedy local builder?

    Are they so bullish on the Wish Town that they think it still has huge potential for growth and is currently undervalued.....may be so or may not?

    Some of the above questions come to my mind...so shared...cheers


    Nice try but no cigar mate - WT isn't uniformly premium to demand something like this, neither sufficiently developed. Had they done this for projects like Pebble, Boomerang etc - it may have added to the mystique but when you have Kosmos etc to the mix then - well, just smacks of typical money making tactics. Infact they even said so in the meeting I believe that they were following industry trends of 35%

    Another example I'll give you. Remember last to last year when they doubled rates - that was a similar tactic to what you say, but really misfired

    You see DLF does this with Aralias and Magnolias quite successfully - 'In the Golf Course' and they charge DOUBLE to 'Outside the GC'.

    Its just that the supply is less inside and the demand is high.

    Even before this Unitech tried premium pricing and care-all attitude with Grande - backfired.

    Its increasingly about delivery, maintenance and feedback.

    ATS (or the market around ATS) encourages premium pricing. I can still challenge anyone that JP WT GC products are better than ATS V or ATS OH - still I am not the market and ATS has a history, a brand in housing which is difficult to dislodge

    3C whatever you may say - will always be thought of as a speedy, nimble builder who largely delivers in time and with quality.

    So net net - no, if Jaypee delivers to full potential then perhaps one day - but not for the foreseeable future. Perhaps only ATS has the pulling power (Tata/Godrej elsewhere) in Noida
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  • Originally Posted by dineshsays
    Nice try but no cigar mate - WT isn't uniformly premium to demand something like this, neither sufficiently developed. Had they done this for projects like Pebble, Boomerang etc - it may have added to the mystique but when you have Kosmos etc to the mix then - well, just smacks of typical money making tactics. Infact they even said so in the meeting I believe that they were following industry trends of 35%

    Another example I'll give you. Remember last to last year when they doubled rates - that was a similar tactic to what you say, but really misfired

    You see DLF does this with Aralias and Magnolias quite successfully - 'In the Golf Course' and they charge DOUBLE to 'Outside the GC'.

    Its just that the supply is less inside and the demand is high.

    Even before this Unitech tried premium pricing and care-all attitude with Grande - backfired.

    Its increasingly about delivery, maintenance and feedback.

    ATS (or the market around ATS) encourages premium pricing. I can still challenge anyone that JP WT GC products are better than ATS V or ATS OH - still I am not the market and ATS has a history, a brand in housing which is difficult to dislodge

    3C whatever you may say - will always be thought of as a speedy, nimble builder who largely delivers in time and with quality.

    So net net - no, if Jaypee delivers to full potential then perhaps one day - but not for the foreseeable future. Perhaps only ATS has the pulling power (Tata/Godrej elsewhere) in Noida


    Thanks for your comments....so wt do u reckon?

    time to move out of jaypee/orchards now or wait some more to see how things unfold.

    Its true that budget of most buyers who stretched themselves to get in Jaypee will be hit big time with so many added cost implications. Every one buys into a project with budget calculations in mind even if spread over 3-4 years.

    Kuch to karna padega bhai.
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  • Re: Jaypee Greens - Noida

    Originally Posted by orchardman
    Thanks for your comments....so wt do u reckon?

    time to move out of jaypee/orchards now or wait some more to see how things unfold.

    Its true that budget of most buyers who stretched themselves to get in Jaypee will be hit big time with so many added cost implications. Every one buys into a project with budget calculations in mind even if spread over 3-4 years.

    Kuch to karna padega bhai.


    Depends on what your goal was....

    Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2
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  • Originally Posted by "ankur.jain83


    Orchardman, not everything is luxury in WT, it has Kosmos and classic too. Luxury is whats trading 10K+ today. Taking this fact, even the household support should be charged a premium. Bottled water sold in WT should only be Evian. Restaurants/Clubs in WT should add Caviar in each dish they serve.
    And maid should be paid double of what the maids in sector 100,110,137 would be paid...after all they would be working in Wishtown. So how can WT residents see their maids taking regular salary?
    Right?


    Orchards for sure is not luxury . Neither are most of the other names mentioned .

    The only thing luxurious about these is the price ...

    Sent from my GT-N7100 using Forum Runner
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  • Originally Posted by Dikraa
    Orchards for sure is not luxury . Neither are most of the other names mentioned .

    The only thing luxurious about these is the price ...

    Sent from my GT-N7100 using Forum Runner


    Its still value for money premium project.....can please u suggest any other project in Noida under 6000 psqft with similar specs and location next to 18+9 hole Golf course.

    All said and done future rates will determine success of this project which is already going very strong and still lot of scope for appreciation left in Orchards.
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  • Re: Jaypee Greens - Noida

    Originally Posted by mayanknoida
    I was at the meeting with two of my relatives who have also invested in JP. The answers to most questions were satisfactory and the atmosphere was congenial.
    It became heated at soon as the question of super area increase came up. JP has decided to increase super area by around 10% for all the older projects .The justification they gave was that the older projects have very less loading ( 20-25 %) and the industry norm is 30-35 so what they were doing was just aligning themselves with what they called was the prevalent practice that was being followed by all builders in the NCR.

    I have 2 flats in PC. One was bought in oct, 2008 in CLP (2 BR) and the second one was bought by my wife in july 2012 in 50-50 plan(2 BR). I was going through the PAL of both with a fine toothed comb last night. here are my discoveries..
    1) The oct. 2008 PAL has no mention about the possibility of super area increase during possession.
    If JP increases my super area then i'm going to fight tooth and nail. I feel i have a strong case.
    2) The oct. 2008 PAL shows 3 balcony's i.e in both bedrooms and drawing room.
    Only 2 balcony's now . So my carpet area has decreased due to one less balcony.

    The new PAL clearly states that area is expected to increase by 7-10% during possession(Mentioned in the map , look at the bottom). It also shows only 2 balcony's in the flat.
    There is no point in going to court or crying if jaypee increases area by upto 10% i.e if your PAL clearly mentions that it is a possibility. JP has you hook , line and sinker. Best is to grin and bear it , i don't think our lame government and or courts can do anything if it is clearly mentioned in the PAL.

    However if your PAL does not mention the possibility of increase, then i feel you should not buckle under pressure and be ready to fight JP. I'm ready to fight it out in court ( For my flat bought in oct, 2008) ,please join me if you are in the same boat. Anyone else here who bought in 2008 or 2009??

    I feel kasablanca and kristal won't have a increase in super area coz they already have a loading of 35%. any more would be unjustifiable. If your project has loading of around 25% then be ready for it to increase by 10%.
    if anyone has any queries , feel free to put them to me.


    I bought in 2009 and in my PAL map it's mentioned 5 to 7 percent. However in the first page it states that any amount of area can increase and that has to be paid. As per the update my flat has an increase of 18 percent. Going by the map I have a strong case but by the first page in the PAL Jaypee has a strong case as they have stated ANY. Let's see what Jaypee has to say about this first.

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  • Can Jaypee really increase the area in particular project depending on the BBA u signed ? I guess not, right... I mean in 2 of us bought the same 3 BR unit, how can one pay zero or 7 or 10 percent increase depending on the same project

    End of the day it's the same project right ?
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  • Re: Jaypee Greens - Noida

    Originally Posted by mpandey78
    I have posted the question to the customer care guy for my project inquiring about the new super area. I got a reply stating WHY increase happens but he did not mention the updated area stating that that would be SHARED at the possession time.
    So, now I have asked him as to what did Mr Ajit Kumar SHARE with us on the 9th of March then and have copied the picture of the chart on the email.
    Now, waiting for his reply as I am curious to see what the response would be. At least, HOPEFULLY, I get some clarification before I look at legal options.


    I have sent two more emails to the Jaypee team and they haven't replied back. This is the first time that I have noticed a delay in response from their end. Tells me that they are avoiding such questions now. Well guess I need to continously keep sending emails and then finally send the entire trail to Mr Manoj Gaur to let him know about how his team is dealing with such queries. Not that it would matter to him as the ship sails on the order of the captain but he needs to still hear from his clients.


    Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2
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  • Originally Posted by dineshsays
    Nice try but no cigar mate - WT isn't uniformly premium to demand something like this, neither sufficiently developed. Had they done this for projects like Pebble, Boomerang etc - it may have added to the mystique but when you have Kosmos etc to the mix then - well, just smacks of typical money making tactics. Infact they even said so in the meeting I believe that they were following industry trends of 35%


    Im always amazed at your ability to remain balanced in views in spite having invested so heavily in WT


    Originally Posted by dineshsays

    Perhaps only ATS has the pulling power (Tata/Godrej elsewhere) in Noida


    so true
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  • Originally Posted by orchardman
    Its still value for money premium project.....can please u suggest any other project in Noida under 6000 psqft with similar specs and location next to 18+9 hole Golf course.

    All said and done future rates will determine success of this project which is already going very strong and still lot of scope for appreciation left in Orchards.


    True, but only in relative terms.

    Lets not forget that the specs for this and many other projects were decided based on the sale price at the time of launch which in some cases was way below 3k psf.

    The market prices today only reflect the fact that the prices are being manipulated and do not necessarily reflect the specs / quality / luxury of the project

    There is a clip running on some business TV channel today that says that since 2004, over 77000 apartments have been built or are under construction / consideration in the NOIDA expressway area... the same clip goes on to speculate whether this is a bubble waiting to burst.

    But isnt the same true of many other areas particularly Gurgaon?

    These and many other doomsdayers don't go on to predict when the bubble is gonna burst.

    Dunno if it is a bubble or just long pent-up demand getting fulfilled. I see a large number of ready properties on the expressway occupied already... a bubble would be a scenario where a fair chunk of the apartments go unoccupied because they are largely investor/speculator owned.

    On the flipside, could this be the reason why JP is not able to sell all its properties?

    what do you think?
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