What do you guys think about Jaypee Greens Wishtown - NOIDA? Is this a good time to buy? Is Wishtown a good investment?

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  • Atleast 25000
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  • Originally Posted by singhpushkar
    Per update from JP, about 1000 letter has been dispatched to buyers and rest are in process.



    Who r these 1000 people? can you tell here that what date is mentioned in the letter?
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  • Can there b a situation when we will never get our flats

    Leave aside delays for a moment

    Its a serious guestion
    All senior members dinesh/ venky/basheer/others pls tell
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  • Theoretically - absolutely
    Practically - not likely
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  • Originally Posted by dineshsays
    Theoretically - absolutely
    Practically - not likely

    Can u pls elaborate both pls
    For clarity
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  • Give me till lunch time tomorrow
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  • Originally Posted by dineshsays
    Give me till lunch time tomorrow

    K pls do respond
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  • We call other builders as chillar but honestly Jaypee looks like a chillar plus chor to me now .. where is our money which we gave to them to build our dream homes ?
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  • in india both RE & airlines industry has become a chillar industry.
    be careful before putting ur money in these sectors.
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  • Originally Posted by dragoman
    We call other builders as chillar but honestly Jaypee looks like a chillar plus chor to me now .. where is our money which we gave to them to build our dream homes ?


    On group level they have debt of Rs 65000 crores.

    They probably pay interest on this debt at rate of 12.5-13% per annum. Now you can calculate the yearly interest cost alone on this amount. This is a huge expense.

    DLF had mentioned in their prospectus last year that they are paying 12.5-13% interest on their debt. I assume JP would be paying interest at nearly the same interest rate.

    Following is the prospectus of JP Associates QIP that happened in July 2014. Start reading from page 244 of 325 of the PDF file if you want to see detailed accounts of JP associates

    http://www.bseindia.com/downloads/ipo/2014721182441Project%20Ganga%20Final%20PD.pdf
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  • Originally Posted by dineshsays
    Give me till lunch time tomorrow


    Dinesh bhai also look fwd to ur thoughts on the l&t leaving orchards and kube news pls.
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  • Originally Posted by dineshsays
    Give me till lunch time tomorrow


    Dinesh brother, plz confirm the news of L&T leaving Orchards if you plan to visit the site.
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  • Sorry Guys - I have no idea on the L&T issue. I obviously don't go to WT these days much at all. The reason is simple - what is the point. Earlier it was the excitement of genuine progress and speed, sharing with my family and sharing with you guys - still remember Imperial and Orchards were doing 2 floors a month and now - zilch for the best part of a year.

    I feel very sad personally - as I am sure do all of you

    Anyhow, my thoughts on the point DC posted earlier - can there be a scenario where we do not get our houses.

    My honest viewpoint is - not likely, but theoretically - very much possible, might even happen for Sports City or Agra etc unless regulation change. Infact your question should be answered via a PIL

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    Why?

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    - There is no regulator who is ensuring the builders are delivering
    - There is no regulation or law that the house HAS to be delivered OR personal assets will be seized OR some other business assets may be used to service this business first. That's not how a public limited company works, there is no - moral prioritization as mandated by law. KFA has not paid salaries - they've not paid. Mallya is not involving his liquor business to save the airlines (no cross-contamination across business lines). You see him partying with F1 crowds or at RCB parties, while old employees are on the streets - no one is battling an eyelid.
    - Yes there are thoughts about escrow etc for Real Estate projects but who does that and what litigation measures have been taken previously. Even if now we prove that JP has siphoned off money to other projects - what recourse do we have for money that is gone?
    - Say if the JP group declares bankruptcy in a worst case scenario - then they may be jailed or may not be - chances are their share value may go to 0 but personal wealth may already have been there - and their new breed may just be very happy with.
    - Now if they declare bankruptcy - then you are a debtor and so is the bank. But what is the asset - half built flats - flats only on paper or what not. Chances are banks will get the premium stuff and you - because you are individual and a million times less powerful as a bank may get the raw end of the stick. Basically some formula will come up - a third developer may be involved who will demand huge payments (JP had taken money in cash - they're not likely to give it to these new guys) to construct and deliver the rest. Note he will only do it if he sees profit. So this recent thing about reliance taking over - ask yourself - why would reliance be interested in delivering flats that they will not get much money for.

    BASICALLY - it will be a BIG MESS - but your flat may not be recovered at all. JP promoters may be in deep shit - in jail maybe - but your flat is GONE.

    - Continuing with the negative theme - JP may not even declare bankruptcy but may just not deliver - or deliver very very very slowly - then what do you do? What legal recourse do you take - yes there would be ill-will but JP will have to see - is servicing of loan worth 8CR interest a day more important or keeping the interests of people like us more important (along with taking doses of ill will). Yes Sports City may not be sold or Agra may not be sold - ok sure - they simply sell parts of that land to 3C and the likes and they sell as they have a better name - haha!! Shout and slogan all you like. Remember - one of the job of a company is to protect their investors - shares have plummeted to rubbish levels - you dont see Jaypee jumping to do what it takes to protect people's interests.

    Anyhow - these are some worst case scenarios - JP kids all being ok with personal wealth, companies go down the drain, public can go f*** itself, all what we thought is backfiring and has no future etc, let stock price get to 0 - we may even make money in short selling - a little unlikely if we see historically and even now

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    Now what is the real world scenario:

    - While not as focused or delivery conscious as JP Gaur - Manoj Gaur and company have still always delivered
    - Look at YEW, JP Noida, F1, Parwanoo eWay, or JIT at 62/63, New Hospital or whatever - all projects to the best of my knowledge have been delivered and are very very good (by most standards)
    - They have woken up to the responsible fact that debt has to be reduced - come what may - they are losing a lot of their gems which must be hurting
    - They have publicly mentioned that RE is their key asset and focus for development going forward
    - They have a shitload of land whose realization is directly dependent on how they do in WT
    - They have a lot of money to be collected in WT itself (by completing delivery)
    - And most importantly I don't think the family is the Vijay Mallya types
    - Economy is getting a little better
    - A lot of the difficult work in WT is done - viz they are a year or 2 from reaping the benefits (in terms of being able to sell more - if not so much being able to realise too much from handover as fitments are expensive)
    - WT is not so much of a problem child - viz. you have a SC ruling that this land is fine

    So in all probability - I dont see them not delivering - it is most likely a cash flow situation and/or issues with the current SP government (which is the worst option for UP - how they come to power every few years is beyond me) and because of that WT seems to have the biggest impact; and things should at some point will be back on track even if it does turn around slowly

    We need to go legal and keep our fight up
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  • Thanx dinesh for d effort
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  • Guys, post 30th August meeting, to further our efforts and agenda to get our flats we have managed to be part of a part of NDTV Property Show to question Jaypee on the delays that are hapenning. President of Credai, Geetamber Anand, CEO of Eldeco, Pankaj, Ex head of CCI and some other prominent lawyers were part of the Panel.
    Please watch it at 7.00 PM & 11.00 PM today on NDTV Prime - The property Show hosted by Manisha Atwal. Jaypee and Unitech were the two main talking points. Follow up programs will happen in the following weeks.
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