What do you guys think about Jaypee Greens Wishtown - NOIDA? Is this a good time to buy? Is Wishtown a good investment?

Cheers! :)
Read more
Reply
8001 Replies
Sort by :Filter by :
  • Got your point but I don't see any option for the investors other than going legal. Whatever else they tried (meeting with the owners, collective group approach, dharnas, bad publicity etc) is not working. If they don't pay in illegal demands then unit can has a high risk of getting cancelled which means builder have them by their bxxls (Sorry for using this!!).

    I expect more buyers to take legal action in near future against such a late delay from JP. There is nothing left from them to wait for; some of the units were sold back in 2006 or so. Being patient and hope is one thing but this has taken too long of a time to provide benefit of doubt to the builder.


    Originally Posted by Poddarvaib
    By resources I mean money available to contractors etc. You have my best wishes if you are going to sue JP and get 24% cumulative interest for everybody.

    My cousin owns a property in Kingswood. I read an interesting post from one of the other owners about going to the courts for possession. It seems that this gentleman owned an apartment in another complex ( not Jaypee) and the builder was delaying. Work was ongoing but there were delays and these apartment owners sued. The courts got involved and the project is now under court orders and at a total standstill. All I mean to say is that litigation can be a double edged sword so it does make sense to evaluate all other options and then go for it.

    Trust me, I have been as badly screwed by JP as anyone else but lets be realistic. We are in India and the courts don't move so quickly, particularly when you are moving against big shot builders and top lawyers.
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by Poddarvaib
    By resources I mean money available to contractors etc. You have my best wishes if you are going to sue JP and get 24% cumulative interest for everybody.

    My cousin owns a property in Kingswood. I read an interesting post from one of the other owners about going to the courts for possession. It seems that this gentleman owned an apartment in another complex ( not Jaypee) and the builder was delaying. Work was ongoing but there were delays and these apartment owners sued. The courts got involved and the project is now under court orders and at a total standstill. All I mean to say is that litigation can be a double edged sword so it does make sense to evaluate all other options and then go for it.

    Trust me, I have been as badly screwed by JP as anyone else but lets be realistic. We are in India and the courts don't move so quickly, particularly when you are moving against big shot builders and top lawyers.


    Understand your views but than what is the way out ,Just keep quit and wait for home which will take decade to build (If all goes well). There are judgement again big builder also like DLF, parasvnath etc..
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by Poddarvaib
    By resources I mean money available to contractors etc. You have my best wishes if you are going to sue JP and get 24% cumulative interest for everybody.

    My cousin owns a property in Kingswood. I read an interesting post from one of the other owners about going to the courts for possession. It seems that this gentleman owned an apartment in another complex ( not Jaypee) and the builder was delaying. Work was ongoing but there were delays and these apartment owners sued. The courts got involved and the project is now under court orders and at a total standstill. All I mean to say is that litigation can be a double edged sword so it does make sense to evaluate all other options and then go for it.

    Trust me, I have been as badly screwed by JP as anyone else but lets be realistic. We are in India and the courts don't move so quickly, particularly when you are moving against big shot builders and top lawyers.

    Thanks and really appreciate your concerns....
    Its not only delay but tons of others factors in RE where owners ve to fight against it.
    court or other forums takes time but in the end customers will win if they have concrete evidence..
    In JP case its a pandora box, if it opens then jp should be afraid not us.. rest time will tell... :-)
    CommentQuote
  • Indian law: Caveat emptor or Buyer beware


    The judgement in case of Supertech was breach of Norms and for DLF the agreement ( by CCI)

    None of the cases unfair conditions in BBA (signed by buyer) is penalized, only commented by way of providing model BBA template (in case of DLF by CCI).

    Any agreement signed will only be nullified if it is by coersion as per contract law.

    Buyer has always the option to not sign otherwise (sans coersion)

    Legal route is advised only after making registration in your name.




    Originally Posted by t_yash
    Thanks and really appreciate your concerns....
    Its not only delay but tons of others factors in RE where owners ve to fight against it.
    court or other forums takes time but in the end customers will win if they have concrete evidence..
    In JP case its a pandora box, if it opens then jp should be afraid not us.. rest time will tell... :-)
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by abhinav_2325
    aman and kosmos are blessing in disguise for our low/middle income country men, a must- grab


    bas karo bhai
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by ga_fms
    Indian law: Caveat emptor or Buyer beware


    The judgement in case of Supertech was breach of Norms and for DLF the agreement ( by CCI)

    None of the cases unfair conditions in BBA (signed by buyer) is penalized, only commented by way of providing model BBA template (in case of DLF by CCI).

    Any agreement signed will only be nullified if it is by coersion as per contract law.

    Buyer has always the option to not sign otherwise (sans coersion)

    Legal route is advised only after making registration in your name.


    Once registration is made most of the buyers will forget the pain inflicted upon them and let it be. This is typical Indian mindset, choddon na yaar types.
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by t_yash
    Thanks and really appreciate your concerns....
    Its not only delay but tons of others factors in RE where owners ve to fight against it.
    court or other forums takes time but in the end customers will win if they have concrete evidence..
    In JP case its a pandora box, if it opens then jp should be afraid not us.. rest time will tell... :-)


    What you say is ideologically correct. However, legal fights in India require a lot of patience and deep pockets besides a lot of time. Practically not sure how many will be willing to take it up. It is one thing to say let's take the fight to them and another to actually do it.

    Secondly I agree with GA fms and feel that it will be almost impossible to get 24% interest on your capital from the courts. I can't think of any judgement such as this being passed ( I am not an expert on this front). Plus if JP doesnt have the money which it doesnt what will happen?? Obviously the courts will not pay. It will be too messy and long in my opinion with little to gain.

    As you rightly said, time will tell!!
    CommentQuote
  • Hi,

    I am looking for RTM on expressway, last sunday we visited Cosmos and Klassic.....Like Klassic more. Loading is very less.

    What is the on going rate for Cosmos & Klassic? Is it good buy ....as there is no other option available at expressway at cheap price.

    Kindly guide.
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by saihtul
    Hi,

    I am looking for RTM on expressway, last sunday we visited Cosmos and Klassic.....Like Klassic more. Loading is very less.

    What is the on going rate for Cosmos & Klassic? Is it good buy ....as there is no other option available at expressway at cheap price.

    Kindly guide.


    this might help
    https://www.facebook.com/groups/jaypee.greens.wishtown.noida/
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by saihtul
    Hi,

    I am looking for RTM on expressway, last sunday we visited Cosmos and Klassic.....Like Klassic more. Loading is very less.

    What is the on going rate for Cosmos & Klassic? Is it good buy ....as there is no other option available at expressway at cheap price.

    Kindly guide.

    klassic on going rates are around 4400-4700 BSP for ready towers , rest of the towers you can get for 4200-4400 depends on location and floor, last deal i heard was around 4400 in b2 tower for 3 bhk apartment . 7th floor
    CommentQuote
  • Three pronged legal attack plan on Jaypee

    Originally Posted by ga_fms
    Indian law: Caveat emptor or Buyer beware


    The judgement in case of Supertech was breach of Norms and for DLF the agreement ( by CCI)

    None of the cases unfair conditions in BBA (signed by buyer) is penalized, only commented by way of providing model BBA template (in case of DLF by CCI).

    Any agreement signed will only be nullified if it is by coersion as per contract law.

    Buyer has always the option to not sign otherwise (sans coersion)

    Legal route is advised only after making registration in your name.


    While you are largely right, please consider an alternative plan below:

    A three pronged legal attack plan which DTPOWS can adopt.

    Prelim points:

    1. Engage cheap lawyer only - rely on the legal merits rather than on expensive lawyer

    2. Simultaneously file case in three courts - legal fee for filing case is just few hundred rupees

    3. Each case is different but lawyer is same and DTPOWS pays for it.

    4. Send legal notice of all 3 cases to Jaypee before filing, to fine tune the points and to get notice of their counter arguments

    5. File regardless of their reply as a bargaining tactic - especially the arrest of promoters tactic

    6. Be ready to withdraw one or more case i.e. they are bargaining counters as well - so before filing we negotiate with Jayee.

    The three cases which should be filed are as follows

    1. Consumer court: This can be approached by people who dont want their flat. A lot of people have booked in 2009 and are sitting on very poor gains. People booking in 2011 are sitting on losses. Both groups have seen their deadline pass by. A number of judgements have come where because of delay, the builder has been asked to return capital with 18% interest.

    Let us assume someone booked in 2009 and by 2012 had made 90% of payment and construction is stuck. Let us assume 50L had been paid in CLP till 2012. Then from 2012 to 2015 i.e. three years, 50L at 18% compound interest becomes 85 Lakhs. In addition, some money would have been paid from 2009 to 2012 also and the interest amount from that would become another 15 lakh, so 1 crore would be the amount as of 2015 - whih means you can file in national consumer redressal coommission. Most consumer courts give verdict after 2 years - by which time more of 18% interest would add up - and in most cases, still the flat would nt get ready. Adding interest till 2017, the amount with interest at 18% becomes 1.43 crores.

    So instead of flat, you can opt for 1.43 crores in cash even for 50 Lakhs flat. Even if the flat gets delivered, it will cost much less than this amount and will probably sell for less than 1 crore. So this is a viable option, especially given the real estate slow down.

    Please note that this is not delay compensation - this is return of capital with penal interest. There are 3 verdicts which have given this penal interest, and such a case in consumer court is most likely to stick. So the 12% delay penalty charged from buyers is not a concern in this at all - this is return of capital.

    Please note again - if Jaypee does not honour the verdict, their promoters will go to jail. Their only appeal is the supreme court - which i unlikely to entertain the appeal and is likely to throw it out without hearing based on written submission. Consumer court can also direct a payment be made pending appeal - so you get the award immediately regardless of appeal.

    If 50 people who are ready to forgo flat and get money instead can be found - Jaypee will have to pay 75 crore. A big thing.

    Simply filing this case is enough for the association to have Jaypee where it wants - because Jaypee cannot risk adverse verdict, since everybody will prefer 18% rather than flat.

    It can be used to armtwist Jaypee into forgoing super area increase - or if it gets increased, they dont charge for it (so we get it free) - a legally binding agreement to this effect - and additional compensation - can be got from Jaypee in return for dropping the suit.

    It can be filed immediately and regardless of registry because those who file dont want the flat.

    2. Allahabad High Court. We can file a case against Jaypee for not following the rules of UP Apartment Act i.e. super area increase being illegal. Filed by DTPOWS against JP, quoting the long commentary on UP apartment act given by Allahad High COurt in 2013. This is only a diversionary tactic, because the court will say - final measurement will form the basis.

    Our point will be that even if there is increase, we will pay stamp duty but we will not pay JP extra for the super area increase. This will have to be filed only by those people who have got their flat delivery i.e. Pavillion, Klassic, some towers of Kosmos and few others.

    If we win the case, JP will have to return the extra money they have charged for super area increase.

    3. Competition commission. It is expensive to do real fight in this court. Lawyers will be interested in sucking our blood only. We should file a "try our chance" petition here using cheap lawyer. Our claims will be

    a. Jaypee is dominant
    b. Jaypee did not do builder buyer agreement but only allotment letter and application form
    c. Jaypee mislead the buyers by giving 10-16% lower super area when selling
    d. They did not disclose building blueprint plans
    e. They increased super area at the end in a planned way to cheat the buyers - and made erroneous calculations for Pavillon and Klassic (as I have already posted on IREF) by including areas which should not have been included.
    f. This is abuse of dominance
    g. Average of 10% of super area increase is being demanded by Jaypee
    h. They should be penalised by stripping them of these profits being made in a malafide way by abuse of dominant postion.
    i. Also that the promoters who are in violation of UP apartment act should be arrested as laid down in the act and punished according to the laws applicable

    This case will be filed as a flanking petition only - and we will not spend money on this - because we get nothing from it. Our aim is only that we either withdraw this petition because we settle the super area issue out of court with Jaypee - or we pursue the case with minimal costs just to strip Jaypee of its ill gotten gains due to super area increase - so that even if they win in Allahabad high court or do not settle with us - they stand an even chance of being stripped of these profits and penalised in addition to it.

    All three cases should be filed simultaneously because they form a part of a larger plan - our goals from all this would be

    1. If super area is increased, fine, but we wont pay for it

    2. Increased compensation for delay to withdraw the case from consumer court

    From filing all three cases, nobody gets harmed and it costs very little. So it makes sense to go ahead.

    DTPOWS can also file a fourth and fifth cases as follows

    4. File a complaint in NOIDA authority that building plans have not been disclosed as per UP apartment act

    5. File a case in Allahabad high court after this NOIDA Authority complaint - saying that Jaypee is in violation of UP apartment act because of non disclosure - and that the promoters be arrested as laid down in UP apartments act.
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by Venkytalks
    While you are largely right, please consider an alternative plan below:

    A three pronged legal attack plan which DTPOWS can adopt.

    Prelim points:

    1. Engage cheap lawyer only - rely on the legal merits rather than on expensive lawyer

    2. Simultaneously file case in three courts - legal fee for filing case is just few hundred rupees

    3. Each case is different but lawyer is same and DTPOWS pays for it.

    4. Send legal notice of all 3 cases to Jaypee before filing, to fine tune the points and to get notice of their counter arguments

    5. File regardless of their reply as a bargaining tactic - especially the arrest of promoters tactic

    6. Be ready to withdraw one or more case i.e. they are bargaining counters as well - so before filing we negotiate with Jayee.

    The three cases which should be filed are as follows

    1. Consumer court: This can be approached by people who dont want their flat. A lot of people have booked in 2009 and are sitting on very poor gains. People booking in 2011 are sitting on losses. Both groups have seen their deadline pass by. A number of judgements have come where because of delay, the builder has been asked to return capital with 18% interest.

    Let us assume someone booked in 2009 and by 2012 had made 90% of payment and construction is stuck. Let us assume 50L had been paid in CLP till 2012. Then from 2012 to 2015 i.e. three years, 50L at 18% compound interest becomes 85 Lakhs. In addition, some money would have been paid from 2009 to 2012 also and the interest amount from that would become another 15 lakh, so 1 crore would be the amount as of 2015 - whih means you can file in national consumer redressal coommission. Most consumer courts give verdict after 2 years - by which time more of 18% interest would add up - and in most cases, still the flat would nt get ready. Adding interest till 2017, the amount with interest at 18% becomes 1.43 crores.

    So instead of flat, you can opt for 1.43 crores in cash even for 50 Lakhs flat. Even if the flat gets delivered, it will cost much less than this amount and will probably sell for less than 1 crore. So this is a viable option, especially given the real estate slow down.

    Please note that this is not delay compensation - this is return of capital with penal interest. There are 3 verdicts which have given this penal interest, and such a case in consumer court is most likely to stick. So the 12% delay penalty charged from buyers is not a concern in this at all - this is return of capital.

    Please note again - if Jaypee does not honour the verdict, their promoters will go to jail. Their only appeal is the supreme court - which i unlikely to entertain the appeal and is likely to throw it out without hearing based on written submission. Consumer court can also direct a payment be made pending appeal - so you get the award immediately regardless of appeal.

    If 50 people who are ready to forgo flat and get money instead can be found - Jaypee will have to pay 75 crore. A big thing.

    Simply filing this case is enough for the association to have Jaypee where it wants - because Jaypee cannot risk adverse verdict, since everybody will prefer 18% rather than flat.

    It can be used to armtwist Jaypee into forgoing super area increase - or if it gets increased, they dont charge for it (so we get it free) - a legally binding agreement to this effect - and additional compensation - can be got from Jaypee in return for dropping the suit.

    It can be filed immediately and regardless of registry because those who file dont want the flat.

    2. Allahabad High Court. We can file a case against Jaypee for not following the rules of UP Apartment Act i.e. super area increase being illegal. Filed by DTPOWS against JP, quoting the long commentary on UP apartment act given by Allahad High COurt in 2013. This is only a diversionary tactic, because the court will say - final measurement will form the basis.

    Our point will be that even if there is increase, we will pay stamp duty but we will not pay JP extra for the super area increase. This will have to be filed only by those people who have got their flat delivery i.e. Pavillion, Klassic, some towers of Kosmos and few others.

    If we win the case, JP will have to return the extra money they have charged for super area increase.

    3. Competition commission. It is expensive to do real fight in this court. Lawyers will be interested in sucking our blood only. We should file a "try our chance" petition here using cheap lawyer. Our claims will be

    a. Jaypee is dominant
    b. Jaypee did not do builder buyer agreement but only allotment letter and application form
    c. Jaypee mislead the buyers by giving 10-16% lower super area when selling
    d. They did not disclose building blueprint plans
    e. They increased super area at the end in a planned way to cheat the buyers - and made erroneous calculations for Pavillon and Klassic (as I have already posted on IREF) by including areas which should not have been included.
    f. This is abuse of dominance
    g. Average of 10% of super area increase is being demanded by Jaypee
    h. They should be penalised by stripping them of these profits being made in a malafide way by abuse of dominant postion.
    i. Also that the promoters who are in violation of UP apartment act should be arrested as laid down in the act and punished according to the laws applicable

    This case will be filed as a flanking petition only - and we will not spend money on this - because we get nothing from it. Our aim is only that we either withdraw this petition because we settle the super area issue out of court with Jaypee - or we pursue the case with minimal costs just to strip Jaypee of its ill gotten gains due to super area increase - so that even if they win in Allahabad high court or do not settle with us - they stand an even chance of being stripped of these profits and penalised in addition to it.

    All three cases should be filed simultaneously because they form a part of a larger plan - our goals from all this would be

    1. If super area is increased, fine, but we wont pay for it

    2. Increased compensation for delay to withdraw the case from consumer court

    From filing all three cases, nobody gets harmed and it costs very little. So it makes sense to go ahead.

    DTPOWS can also file a fourth and fifth cases as follows

    4. File a complaint in NOIDA authority that building plans have not been disclosed as per UP apartment act

    5. File a case in Allahabad high court after this NOIDA Authority complaint - saying that Jaypee is in violation of UP apartment act because of non disclosure - and that the promoters be arrested as laid down in UP apartments act.



    As usual excellent ideas by Venky Bhai...........

    But karega kaun? This janata is only paper tiger on internet & FB. No real gut, inclination, interest or time to fight for a right cause.

    Good Luck
    CommentQuote
  • Mr venky , as usual very informative and useful
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by mukud12
    You know guys that Jaypee has become a brand in real estate market. You can invest your money.


    Joke of the day , on What basis you are saying
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by Satya1212
    As usual excellent ideas by Venky Bhai...........

    But karega kaun? This janata is only paper tiger on internet & FB. No real gut, inclination, interest or time to fight for a right cause.

    Good Luck

    DTPOWS should do it.

    I however have resigned from DTPOWS long ago since I dont have time for it and also have health problems preventing active role and other reasons as I had posted on Jaypee Greens DTPOWS facebook page some months ago.
    CommentQuote