Would be interested to know the prevailing property prices in areas like Pimple Saudagar and Pimple gurav. Is there a downturn in the prices or it is still upwards?
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  • Originally Posted by amit_2009
    you should easily get a decent 3BHK flat in PS if you have 30L ready liquidity and are willing to provide a higher downpayment percentage.


    btw, all this talk of market improving is bluff. Only the stock market has risen in the last couple of weeks. This does not mean anything for the Real estate. All other real economic indicators are spiralling downwards each passing day... but what do these brokers know about such stuff.. they think the stock market increase means that the economy is booming upwards!

    hell, companies like DLF, Unitech. Indiabulls are selling themselves... you know what does it mean by recent news of raising money to pay off debt interests by "private placement of equity" for institutionalised investments... the RE company owners have to sell off part of their ownership in the stock market to raise money for debt interest payments and prevent themselves from going bankrupt!


    There is no actual improvement of the economy... people who hold on to their hard earned money for the next 9-12 months would be surprised to see the gains made from patience.


    Amit,
    Very good post. Finally i see some logical posts in this thread. Few differences between stock and RE markets.

    1.RE market prices depend on demand-supply ratio. And the demand is decided by retail buyers unlike the FIIs in stock market. With job market becoming worse each day, its tougher to find buyers for the flats. And this is leading to huge supply and no demand problem which is going to take the RE market towards crash.
    (People, must have heard around 10k Satyam employees are going to get laid off. There are many other companies which are laying off silently.)

    2. The investment in stocks can be liquidated on any given day. In RE, one has to find a buyer for his property which may take months, specially in this scenario.Add to it, the stamp duty one has to pay Plus the profit earned after selling property is taxable. However, in case of stocks if you invest for more than an year, the income is tax free. The stock market and RE markets are totally unrelated.

    In 2005, when the flat prices were lower, lots of people bought flats for investment. Right now, only genuine buyers are looking to buy and even those are not turning up because of the loot going on by the builders. No investors are are buying flats, in fact those who bought eariler are looking to book the profit as there are clear signs of the rates going down.
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  • ***************
    you should easily get a decent 3BHK flat in PS if you have 30L ready liquidity and are willing to provide a higher downpayment percentage.
    ***************
    Is it true? Why should it make any difference to the builder if I pay more as down payment or take loan? I mean all banks except nationalised banks disburse loans in less than a week. So for a builder, a customer paying in cash or a customer taking loan makes a weeks difference. Why should it make a major impact?

    **************
    There is no actual improvement of the economy... people who hold on to their hard earned money for the next 9-12 months would be surprised to see the gains made from patience.
    **************
    Hope this come out to be true. I have waited 18 months, won't mind 9 months additional wait. However, this could depend on possession date as well. So for e.g.my rental is 10K, then I spend 90k in 10 months hoping to get the house for at least 90K cheaper. I would rather buy a house at 90K higher price now than waiting for later. So the point is that there is a delicate balance there which needs to be watched out.
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  • Originally Posted by punebloke
    ***************
    you should easily get a decent 3BHK flat in PS if you have 30L ready liquidity and are willing to provide a higher downpayment percentage.
    ***************
    Is it true? Why should it make any difference to the builder if I pay more as down payment or take loan? I mean all banks except nationalised banks disburse loans in less than a week. So for a builder, a customer paying in cash or a customer taking loan makes a weeks difference. Why should it make a major impact?

    **************
    There is no actual improvement of the economy... people who hold on to their hard earned money for the next 9-12 months would be surprised to see the gains made from patience.
    **************
    Hope this come out to be true. I have waited 18 months, won't mind 9 months additional wait. However, this could depend on possession date as well. So for e.g.my rental is 10K, then I spend 90k in 10 months hoping to get the house for at least 90K cheaper. I would rather buy a house at 90K higher price now than waiting for later. So the point is that there is a delicate balance there which needs to be watched out.


    Punebloke,

    I very much agree with you. I have been waiting from more than last 18 months too.

    You missed one point above. If you calculate the interest to buy a flat which you rent for 10k, it will turn out to me much more. Plus in the mean time there are very dark chances of rates going down.
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  • i would invest heavily if there is a ticker in the stock market which states "Pune real estate", unfortunately there isnt any such.

    The reason i say this is because Pune has neither seen a noticeable correction nor will see it even if the Indian real estate corrects again. And Pune has grown heavily if you look at the data on working population and their income. Unless a developing country like India falls into a heavy recession in the next 1-3 years which is most unlikely the case, i cannot believe if someones says Pune prices will get heavily corrected especially in the upcoming areas. For already established areas where rates have gone upto more than 5000 per sq ft, there is a chance of 10-15% correction which effects to a big amount.
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  • Originally Posted by punebloke
    ***************
    you should easily get a decent 3BHK flat in PS if you have 30L ready liquidity and are willing to provide a higher downpayment percentage.
    ***************
    Is it true? Why should it make any difference to the builder if I pay more as down payment or take loan? I mean all banks except nationalised banks disburse loans in less than a week. So for a builder, a customer paying in cash or a customer taking loan makes a weeks difference. Why should it make a major impact?

    **************
    There is no actual improvement of the economy... people who hold on to their hard earned money for the next 9-12 months would be surprised to see the gains made from patience.
    **************
    Hope this come out to be true. I have waited 18 months, won't mind 9 months additional wait. However, this could depend on possession date as well. So for e.g.my rental is 10K, then I spend 90k in 10 months hoping to get the house for at least 90K cheaper. I would rather buy a house at 90K higher price now than waiting for later. So the point is that there is a delicate balance there which needs to be watched out.


    Whatever downpayment you are going to pay, put that amount in Fixed Deposit and you will get almost all of the rent that you are going to pay from the interest of your FD. :)
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  • Originally Posted by tsongt
    i would invest heavily if there is a ticker in the stock market which states "Pune real estate", unfortunately there isnt any such.

    The reason i say this is because Pune has neither seen a noticeable correction nor will see it even if the Indian real estate corrects again. And Pune has grown heavily if you look at the data on working population and their income. Unless a developing country like India falls into a heavy recession in the next 1-3 years which is most unlikely the case, i cannot believe if someones says Pune prices will get heavily corrected especially in the upcoming areas. For already established areas where rates have gone upto more than 5000 per sq ft, there is a chance of 10-15% correction which effects to a big amount.

    On the contrary, Pune RE may suffer pain evenif RE market in rest of the india will come up. Pune has grown along with other cities in India only difference being, Pune has grown majorly on the back of the IT.
    Pune RE especially has most of the customers as IT folks. Even if India doesn't go into recession in next 1-3 yrs, it is unlikely to see any salary hikes for IT ppl. Job security is definitely a cause of concern. Correction for the sake of affordability is inevitable in Pune Realty.
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  • Originally Posted by punebloke
    ***************
    you should easily get a decent 3BHK flat in PS if you have 30L ready liquidity and are willing to provide a higher downpayment percentage.
    ***************
    Is it true? Why should it make any difference to the builder if I pay more as down payment or take loan? I mean all banks except nationalised banks disburse loans in less than a week. So for a builder, a customer paying in cash or a customer taking loan makes a weeks difference. Why should it make a major impact?

    **************
    There is no actual improvement of the economy... people who hold on to their hard earned money for the next 9-12 months would be surprised to see the gains made from patience.
    **************
    Hope this come out to be true. I have waited 18 months, won't mind 9 months additional wait. However, this could depend on possession date as well. So for e.g.my rental is 10K, then I spend 90k in 10 months hoping to get the house for at least 90K cheaper. I would rather buy a house at 90K higher price now than waiting for later. So the point is that there is a delicate balance there which needs to be watched out.

    Yuo must be planning to pay some downpayment for your propery purchase. Put that amount in FD and the interest of the FD will almost earn you the house rent you are paying.
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  • IT is the big share of income everywhere including Chennai, Bangalore, Pune or Hyd. You cannot single Pune alone, for sure.

    compare PS or wakad with similar localities in Bangalore or Chennai which are within the range of 6-8 kms away from the core city. You cannot find a decent locality in these cities where you will get a 2BHK/1000 Sq ft apts with decent amenities for around 30L or Rs 3000 psft, and that is still available in Pune.
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  • Originally Posted by tsongt
    IT is the big share of income everywhere including Chennai, Bangalore, Pune or Hyd. You cannot single Pune alone, for sure.

    compare PS or wakad with similar localities in Bangalore or Chennai which are within the range of 6-8 kms away from the core city. You cannot find a decent locality in these cities where you will get a 2BHK/1000 Sq ft apts with decent amenities for around 30L or Rs 3000 psft, and that is still available in Pune.


    I do not have idea about Chennai and Hyd but the infrastructure is much better in Bangalore in places 6-8-10-12 kms around the city. It is already developed area. PS, in my opinion is far behind in terms of regular infrastructure. A wait till monsoon will justify my concerns about infra in PS. It is tough to find vegetable market/bank/atm in this area.

    Rates in Bangalore has also corrected a lot in last cpl of yrs and is still counting but still If we say that Bangalore is a tad bit costlier than Pune, it is much more rewarding also in terms of compensations (pay packages) w.r.to Pune.

    However, I feel PS and other area will come up in future (no way out) but that will take long long time (especially with significant reduction in buying power of IT folks).
    One should have early buyer's advantage while buying in such areas. I don't see that right now in PS/Wakad etc.
    I can not see getting multifold returns 3-5 yrs down the line by buying in relatively underdeveloped areas.

    Of course, my personal opinion.... others may choose to differ :) in places 6-8-10-12 kms around the city. It is already developed area. PS, in my opinion is far behind in terms of regular infrastructure. A wait till monsoon will justify my concerns about infra in PS. It is tough to find vegetable market/bank/atm in this area.

    Rates in Bangalore has also corrected a lot in last cpl of yrs and is still counting but still If we say that Bangalore is a tad bit costlier than Pune, it is much more rewarding also in terms of compensations (pay packages) w.r.to Pune.

    However, I feel PS and other area will come up in future (no way out) but that will take long long time (especially with significant reduction in buying power of IT folks).
    One should have early buyer's advantage while buying in such areas. I don't see that right now in PS/Wakad etc.
    I can not see getting multifold returns 3-5 yrs down the line by buying in relatively underdeveloped areas.

    Of course, my personal opinion.... others may choose to differ :)
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  • i agree about Bangalore infrstructure being much better around the city than Pune. See, the investments always carry a risk whether its stock or RE. Time will decide if its a good investment or not.

    I too cannot imagine today a 5000psf rate in Aundh becoming 10000psf in the next 4 years. But if that happens i am certain that the rates in PS or Wakad may touch 7500 in 4 years time.

    If someone strongly believes that the worst is yet to come, then its wise to wait. If we go with Warren Buffet, we should start buying if you are thinking longterm ;-)

    this is purely my presonal thought. Lets come back to this thread after sometime and see what happens. There are lot of builders who have bought lands in higher prices which is one reason they are not negotiating too much.
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  • Can anyone please provide their inputs on prices of the projects listed below?

    Thanks.

    Originally Posted by ganeshjaju
    Hi guys,

    I have been surveying the PS area since a month.
    I have seen builders quoting less rates initially. But, as the markets have started moving upwards, they have once again started quoting higher rates.

    I am failing to understand if this is hype or real? Don't you think this will result in chaos among people who were hoping that the prices will fall further? As a result, they would start buying immediately so that they don't miss the price dip.

    I would like to know a recent rates of following projects from you guys
    1) Rajaveer Palace
    2) Roseland Rhythm
    3) Mirchandani Palms
    4) Sun Crest
    5) Rose Valley
    6) Sai Heritage
    7) Sai Marigold
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  • This is what one of my colleague had to say during one of these discussions regarding an article posted today (4-Jun-09) in rediff regarding drop in realty prices -

    Housing prices in Pune have also dropped considerably.
    Only the problem is that builders are still showing high rates to customers and we, professionals, have tendency of not negotiating the prices.

    Actual price/sq ft in Wakad is 2100-2200 but builders are quoting it 2600.
    For pimple saudagar, considering the no of ongoing projects, the rates are even lower.
    You will get best price only when u start at low rate (say 2000) and bargain hard.

    P.S. – I got all this information during one of my site visits Wakad from an architect who has designed many prestigious projects in Wakad area. As per him, Pune real estate has not reached its bottom yet, the price will still drop considerably if the buyers show that they are unhappy with the prices.

    So please think before you buy, the price might look good to you but still you can buy at low rates by bargaining.

    Personally, I don't see anything wrong on builders' part. They are doing business and they definitely have right to gain as much profit as possible.
    In free market, prices are always decided by Demand-Supply.

    With the gloomy outlook of IT industry, affordability of >25L house has taken a big hit for the IT folks and hence demand will decrease further until the prices are in affordable range. And investors are no way in teh scene anymore.... only genuine home buyers.

    Builders will not reduce prices because they SHOULD reduce, They will reduce it when they HAVE TO reduce.
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  • Originally Posted by tsongt
    IT is the big share of income everywhere including Chennai, Bangalore, Pune or Hyd. You cannot single Pune alone, for sure.

    compare PS or wakad with similar localities in Bangalore or Chennai which are within the range of 6-8 kms away from the core city. You cannot find a decent locality in these cities where you will get a 2BHK/1000 Sq ft apts with decent amenities for around 30L or Rs 3000 psft, and that is still available in Pune.


    tsongt,

    Rates in Bangalore are at much more realistic level than in Pune. At Banerghatta Road, Bangalore 2 BHK flats are available for 18-20L and 3BHK for 30-35L and these are being offered by very reputed builders.

    One more point, the rent which you get for these flats justify their value. In Bangalore for a 2 BHK flat in decent locality which costs you around 26L, one gets around 12k rent per month. However, in Pune for a 2BHK flat costing 30L the owner struggles to get even 10k as rent.

    To add one more. Bangalore city has much better infrastructure and the center of south. You can't compare Bangalore and Pune rates. Pune rates have to be much lesser. I have stayed in Bangalore in 2006-07. The no of IT companies in Pune are much lesser than in Bangalore. The salaries offerred t IT folks are much more than in Pune.
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  • One of the reasons fot higher rates at Pune is it is close to India's financial hub Mumbai. People who can not afford to invest in Mumbai are investing in Pune real estate.

    I think having Mumbai so close must be beneficial for Pune in other areas but reality.
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  • Originally Posted by tsongt
    i agree about Bangalore infrstructure being much better around the city than Pune. See, the investments always carry a risk whether its stock or RE. Time will decide if its a good investment or not.

    I too cannot imagine today a 5000psf rate in Aundh becoming 10000psf in the next 4 years. But if that happens i am certain that the rates in PS or Wakad may touch 7500 in 4 years time.

    If someone strongly believes that the worst is yet to come, then its wise to wait. If we go with Warren Buffet, we should start buying if you are thinking longterm ;-)

    this is purely my presonal thought. Lets come back to this thread after sometime and see what happens. There are lot of builders who have bought lands in higher prices which is one reason they are not negotiating too much.


    In can understand that In areas like Aundh, where there is no land for further developments, the rates will be sustained,if at all they don't decrease.

    About PS and Wakad area - I think huge amount of land is available for further develpoment. During 2006-07 the land prices went up multiple folds. But now, the land prices too have started coming down. And if you apply simple demand-supply logic for the land too, you too would agree the land prices won't go up at least in Wakad, PS area.

    3 reasons for rates hike in Wakad PS area in 2007-
    1. Very good IT job market.
    2. More demand - less supply.
    3. Increase in construction cost.
    4. Land rates going up.

    But now, i see all 4 factors going against it. So, my personal opinion is that the rates should go down. But if at all they don't(assuming my prediction goes wrong), at least i don't think that the rates are going to get double in PS and Wakad area.

    Affordability is the key factor my dear. Already the flats costs in PS and Wakad area has gone out of reach of 'rich' IT folks. And i don't think the IT salaries are going to get doubled in next 5 years that people are going to buy for double rates :) In fact the chance of IT salaries being cut over the next few years seem to be very dark.
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