Hereby I will prove how the realty boomers arguments are false.

What are the boomers arguments?

1.) Buy today, houses always increase in value in the long run.
WRONG. House prices cannot increase more than incomes in the long run. This is obvious if you think about it. If house prices go up more than people can afford to pay, buying stops, like it has stopped now.
Even Warren Buffett have pointed out that houses don't increase in intrinsic value. Unless there's a bubble or a crash, house prices simply reflect current salaries and interest rates. If a house is 100 years old, it's value in sheltering you is exactly the same as it was 100 years ago. Then came the maintenance as the house didn't renovate itself. It also has taxes, and insurance - costs that always increase and never go away. The price of the house went up about as much as salaries went up.
To put this is simple perspective, vegetable were costing Rs.5-6/kg when 5 digit salary was a rarity.
Today, the prices have gone up by about 4 times but so have the salaries. So, sounds very much like the reasoning people use now when they talk about how much their father's house appreciated "in the long run" without considering that salaries rose a proportional amount.

2.) Renting is just wastage of money.
WRONG. As said before renting is now much cheaper per month than owning. If you don't rent, you either:

* Have a mortgage, in which case you are throwing away money on interest, tax, insurance, maintenance, costs that increase forever.
* Own outright, in which case you are throwing away the extra income you could get by converting your house to cash, investing in bonds, and renting a similar place to live for much less money. This extra income is sufficient for emergency expenses,retirement etc.

Either way, owners lose much more money every month than renters and that's assuming prices don't correct to very high level & everything is smooth in the economy.

3.) As a renter, you won't have any money left as you will spend them on vacations,cars & hence won't have equity/savings etc.
WRONG. Equity is just money. Renters are actually in a better position to build equity/savings through investing in anything but housing. Renters can get rich much faster than owners, just by investing in conservative stocks & bonds.

* Owners are losing every month by paying much more for interest than they would pay for rent. The tax deduction does not come close to making owing competitive with renting.
* Owners must pay taxes simply to own a house. That is not true of stocks, bonds, or any other asset that can build equity/savings. Only houses are such a guaranteed drain on cash.
* Owners must insure a house, but not most other investments.
* Owners must pay to repair a house, but not a stock or a bond.
* Owners lose their money as house prices reduce. The EMI's remain constant in spite of reduction in rates. At the end of loan tenure, they would have paid almost twice than that of current renters who will buy at logical rates. Keep interest rates in mind. Most of the EMI is not principal amount but interest.

4.) There are great tax advantages to owning a house.
WRONG. Many people believe you can just reduce your income tax by the amount you pay in interest, but they are wrong. Buyers may not deduct interest from income tax; they deduct interest from taxable income. And even then, the tax advantage is not significant compared to the large monthly loss from owning.

If you don't own a house but want to live in one, your choice is to rent a house or rent money to buy a house. To rent money is to take out a loan. A mortgage is a money-rental agreement. House renters take no risk at all, but money-renting owners take on the huge risk of falling house prices, as well as all the costs of repairs, insurance, property taxes, etc.

5.) RE is based on local factors, it's not a national phenomenon. RE of Delhi-NCR,Bangalore & rest of the cities has nothing to do with Pune RE.
WRONG. Lending rates remain the same throughout the country. ALL loans are harder to get. This will drive prices down everywhere.

6.) A rental house provides good income. So, you can rent if you have purchased as investment.
WRONG. Rental houses provide very poor income in hyped areas and certainly cannot cover mortgage payments. Remember there is almost 300% difference between EMIs & rent for the same house.

It's pointless to do the work of being a landlord if you can make more money with no risk, no work, and no state income tax by investing in assured good returns bond.

7.) If owning is a loss in monthly cash flow, but appreciation will make up for it.
WRONG. Appreciation is negative. Prices are going down. It only adds to the injury of already high EMI's.

8.) As soon as prices drop a little, the number of buyers on the sidelines willing to jump back in increases.
WRONG. There are very few buyers left, and those who do want to buy will be limited by increasing difficulty of borrowing now that many house owners are near bankrupt as they don't save anything at the end of the month due to high EMI's.
No one has to buy, but there will be more and more people who have no choice but to sell as their payments rise. That will keep driving prices downward for a long time.

9.) House prices never fall atleast in Pune.
WRONG. If you see the RE scenario of 1996, prices crashed by 50% & took a whole 7+ years to recover.
Exact 1996 scenario may not be there today but strong correction is inevitable across the city.

10.) House prices don't fall to zero like stock prices, so it's safer to invest in real estate.
WRONG. House prices won't be zero, but the equity or the principal amount you paid can be zero or even negative. What you will pay as EMIs later in actual terms is not for the principal amount but only the interest as house prices dip. So, you will be only serving the bank.

11.) Prices will soften gradually, won't crash immediately.
WRONG. Prices are falling off a cliff. No one knows exactly what will happen, but it looks like prices will continue to fall for long time. These are just more manipulation of buyer emotions, to get them to buy even while prices are falling.

12.) The bubble prices were driven by supply and demand alone.
WRONG. Prices were driven by low interest rates and risky loans & good returns for investors in initial phases of boom in 2004-05.
Prices went up, interest rates went up & buyers savings went down. So prices are violating the most basic assumptions about supply and demand.

13.) There is lack of land.
WRONG. Ample of land is available & continue to be even in future in Pune. Sales volume are down. Even in Japan (small country with less land), prices went down. Current prices here are the same as that of 23 years ago. If we really had a housing shortage, there would not be so many vacant rentals.

14.) If you don't own, you'll live in a cheap neighborhood later.
WRONG. For the any given monthly payment, you can rent a much better house than you can buy. Renters live better, not worse. There are downsides to renting, such as being told to move at the end of your lease, or having your rent raised, but since there are thousands of vacant rentals, you can take your pick and be quite happy renting during the crash. There are similar but worse problems for owners anyway, such as being fired and losing your house, or having your interest rate and property taxes adjust upward. Remember, property taxes are forever.

15.) There's always someone predicting a real estate crash.
TRUE, yet irrelevant. There are very real crashes every decade or so. Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

16.) Local incomes justify the high prices.
WRONG. The mortgage should be more than your 3 years earning. It is much higher today. Most are already in danger/red zone.

17.) You have to live somewhere.
CORRECT. But that doesn't mean you should waste your life savings on a bad investment. You can live in a better house for much less money by renting during the down slide in RE.

18.) It's not a house, it's a home.
WRONG. Wherever one lives in it is home, be it apartment, condo, bungalow , mansion or house. Calling a house a "home" is a manipulation of your emotions for profit.

19.) If you don't buy now, you'll never get another chance.
WRONG. History proves otherwise.
Here's a beautiful quote from a analyst:-
"The real issue isn't whether you will be stuck being a renter all your life, she says. Its whether you'll get so scared about being shut out that you'll buy at the market's peak and be stuck in a property you can't afford or sell."

20.) It would take major economic recession or a major earthquake that wipes out this area in order for the price to fall by over 50%.
WRONG. Even today, if the prices fall by 50%, there will still be very few people who can buy at this levels due to uncertainty in jobs & most importantly high EMIs. Also, look at the rental rates for equivalent houses. Which loss per month is larger? EMI or rent?

contd....
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  • Originally Posted by Digvijay
    Dear all,

    We all should remember one most important thing, the Chinese are Communist and India we have democratic set up. Dont bash India so much as the privliges you are getting here cannot be compared with China.


    Nobody is bashing India.It's a mere comparison of the infra in China vs India.There are places in India where we standout in the world.Also, for this to happen consistently,we the people, should be acting together rather than leaving it to the politicians.
    CommentQuote
  • Hi Digvijay,

    Good post bu I tend to disagree with you on certain aspects here. These are based on my observations with people I have interacted with on both sides of the border.
    Originally Posted by Digvijay
    We all should remember one most important thing, the Chinese are Communist and India we have democratic set up. Dont bash India so much as the privliges you are getting here cannot be compared with China.

    Go & speak against some 'Bahubali' neta & see where a mango man ends up in 24 hrs. Even police don't help. Read recent newspapers about deepak manakar & goons whose verdict came yesterday. Despite lobbying by Kallu, Congress & ex-DGP AN Roy, the high court bashed them:).
    Justice for mango man is hard & even if he gets one, one generation is passed. Lakhs of cases are pending in courts, some people are jail even being innocent just because their no. is yet to appear in the court:o.
    Ever seen a big shot or his son etc. being arrested for drugs, rape, murder??? Sanjay Dutt case is still going on, & it will go on even after he dies. This is India.

    There is no right to recall, Negative Voting is absent despite being mentioned in constitution, 40% voter turnout, & votes are bought against liquor & money. If you talk about democracy, then only the US & EU can be called as democratic countries. The french fin min used to travel by metro while here even some pandu adivasi kalyan mantri has fleet of escorts.

    A little more digging in past, he told me tht his father never used to get salary, he used to get a house and food for his hardwork.

    And the laborers which you see here come in Merc/BMW/Audi?? I would say that labor exploitation is here as well, rather than comparing India with China, compare India with EU/US & then see the difference. The IT grew in India just because of cheap labor. You increase the salaries comparable to west & outsourcing stops.

    Now the question we should ask is that are we prepared for this, how happy we will be staying in a society like this.

    How happy will you be in staying in that residential complex which will be built on the land sold by Avinash Bhosle to other developer in Mumbai at double the rate he got from govt???

    In last 20 years China has changed quiet much, but we should remember if you want to change so fast and so good, then one full generation has to work for food and shelter not for money. And clearly our generation in India is not redy for it. At least Iam not.

    My take is this:-
    Pay me less, but give me better surrounding,
    Reduce the perks but make sure the world respects & fears our country,
    Tax me more, but make sure that it is put to use for public.

    Btw, my Chinese counterparts have said me frankly that cheating is in our blood especially where there are no checks & balances. Eg. They will send you some other product than what they had shown you as sample but when the shipment is sent to EU/US, these things don't happen, coz Indian govt is least bothered. If Indian Govt is not bothered to protect it's borders in North East, why the hell will it see that India doesn't become dumping ground?:o
    CommentQuote
  • Nice pics Harish

    Nice pics Harish. Liked that. This was Guangzhaou city, here are some pics from Shanghai (Maglev Train).

    1. Taken from inside (there is speedo there, which reads 430 km/hr:),
    2. The platform. By the time you speak, the train is gone:D.
    Attachments:
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by realacres
    Hi Digvijay,

    Good post bu I tend to disagree with you on certain aspects here. These are based on my observations with people I have interacted with on both sides of the border.

    Go & speak against some 'Bahubali' neta & see where a mango man ends up in 24 hrs. Even police don't help. Read recent newspapers about deepak manakar & goons whose verdict came yesterday. Despite lobbying by Kallu, Congress & ex-DGP AN Roy, the high court bashed them:).
    Justice for mango man is hard & even if he gets one, one generation is passed. Lakhs of cases are pending in courts, some people are jail even being innocent just because their no. is yet to appear in the court:o.
    Ever seen a big shot or his son etc. being arrested for drugs, rape, murder??? Sanjay Dutt case is still going on, & it will go on even after he dies. This is India.

    Agreed there are flaws in the system which are being used by many to manipulate the system.

    Chinese courts and policies are very closed, people are executed without trials, no voice raised. As the people who will raise voice will be given such treatment.



    There is no right to recall, Negative Voting is absent despite being mentioned in constitution, 40% voter turnout, & votes are bought against liquor & money. If you talk about democracy, then only the US & EU can be called as democratic countries. The french fin min used to travel by metro while here even some pandu adivasi kalyan mantri has fleet of escorts.

    Its not true, if u rembember cong led 2004 turnaround, u will realise the money and power were on side of BJP , yet the didnt win. In fact we still dont have a single party govt, if buying is so easy the goverment in power would have done so.
    You might be surprised to know till few year back Manmohan Singh's family had a Maruti 800 only.


    And the laborers which you see here come in Merc/BMW/Audi?? I would say that labor exploitation is here as well, rather than comparing India with China, compare India with EU/US & then see the difference. The IT grew in India just because of cheap labor. You increase the salaries comparable to west & outsourcing stops.

    Consider a scenario where u have to work without ur will.
    Iam not saying labourers here have a very gala time, but here they have a choice. People can stop working for their personal reason and out of their personal choice.

    You will suprised to know that all youngsters in a particular town of China were supposed to do same work. Consider suddenly all the people of Pune will be forced to work in textile industry without a choice.


    How happy will you be in staying in that residential complex which will be built on the land sold by Avinash Bhosle to other developer in Mumbai at double the rate he got from govt???

    I dont have that much money to buy a flat there,(kidding). But do u really think that Avinash Bhosle will be able to develop that land now as residential. There is corruption without a doubt, but it is almost everywhere, we being developing country is facing this problem more.

    My take is this:-
    Pay me less, but give me better surrounding,

    Consider a life without pay with just food and average shelter

    Reduce the perks but make sure the world respects & fears our country,

    Well which so ever the way we go the world will respect and fear us. And u will see that in your life time. This is due to our sheer size.



    Tax me more, but make sure that it is put to use for public.

    How about suddenly realising u dont have money to get taxed, as you will be given only food and shelter.

    Actually two decades down China was actually a big social jail. They started opening up from 1979, the effect was visible from 1995 onwards when the normal man life started improving. It might be better staying in china now and I dont argue on that.

    But to achieve that one or two generations has to sacrifice a lot, whether it is forced as is the case with China or willingly as is the case with Japan. As a matter of fact

    1) How many doctors actually work in rural India

    2) How many IIT grads actually stay in India by having such subsidised education.

    We are neither forced nor willing.
    So we should not bash India as general
    CommentQuote
  • Originally Posted by realacres
    Hi Digvijay,

    Good post bu I tend to disagree with you on certain aspects here. These are based on my observations with people I have interacted with on both sides of the border.

    Go & speak against some 'Bahubali' neta & see where a mango man ends up in 24 hrs. Even police don't help. Read recent newspapers about deepak manakar & goons whose verdict came yesterday. Despite lobbying by Kallu, Congress & ex-DGP AN Roy, the high court bashed them:).
    Justice for mango man is hard & even if he gets one, one generation is passed. Lakhs of cases are pending in courts, some people are jail even being innocent just because their no. is yet to appear in the court:o.
    Ever seen a big shot or his son etc. being arrested for drugs, rape, murder??? Sanjay Dutt case is still going on, & it will go on even after he dies. This is India.

    There is no right to recall, Negative Voting is absent despite being mentioned in constitution, 40% voter turnout, & votes are bought against liquor & money. If you talk about democracy, then only the US & EU can be called as democratic countries. The french fin min used to travel by metro while here even some pandu adivasi kalyan mantri has fleet of escorts.


    And the laborers which you see here come in Merc/BMW/Audi?? I would say that labor exploitation is here as well, rather than comparing India with China, compare India with EU/US & then see the difference. The IT grew in India just because of cheap labor. You increase the salaries comparable to west & outsourcing stops.


    How happy will you be in staying in that residential complex which will be built on the land sold by Avinash Bhosle to other developer in Mumbai at double the rate he got from govt???


    My take is this:-
    Pay me less, but give me better surrounding,
    Reduce the perks but make sure the world respects & fears our country,
    Tax me more, but make sure that it is put to use for public.

    Btw, my Chinese counterparts have said me frankly that cheating is in our blood especially where there are no checks & balances. Eg. They will send you some other product than what they had shown you as sample but when the shipment is sent to EU/US, these things don't happen, coz Indian govt is least bothered. If Indian Govt is not bothered to protect it's borders in North East, why the hell will it see that India doesn't become dumping ground?:o


    Real,
    It is the same mango man who is electing these bahubalis that you find are not doing enough for the country and its people. The "have nots" need to realize that they have nothing and it is they who need to put people in power without considering caste, religion, regionality and other stupid divisions and elect those who work for progress. So the key to improving this country is to educate the "have nots" about how to progress and how to elect the right person.
    Indian Democracy is slowly becoming 'By the Elite - For the Elite and Of the Elite'.
    Infact most of these Elite donot even vote. The mango man is the one who turns out to vote.

    This arrangement suits both the Govt and the Elite, because this arrangement creates::
    - Unlimited wealth for the people in Govt
    - 'Pride ' for the Elite
    - Misery for the Rest of India.

    Coming to the discussion, Chinese infra may be good but India is not too bad considering the pockets of development. Go to Hiaranandani complex in Mumbai, Go to Golf links, CP in Delhi, visit the metro railway. i am not comparing as a whole am just again pointing the fact that India is like this because of people like us. We will take a lot of time to change, but yes change will come one day.
    Yes Digvijay, i agree we should not bash India in general.
    High Time to wake up and act together in what ever way WE can.
    CommentQuote
  • Govt of Delhi has just demonstrated to all that it cannot build anything - commonwealth game infrastructure got washed away in the rain.

    In China, the project manager would have been executed - thats why the metro of Guongzu looks the way it does and our metro looks the way it does.

    In India, the project engineer must have bought a 500syd bungalow in south delhi's poshest colony. And the minister in charge would have filled up his election coffers. Nothing will happen to them. It never has in 60 years history.
    CommentQuote
  • I am afraid the real and hidden and dirty stories of China's growth have not been told yet. Behind its glitzy townships and polished metros, there is a huge underbelly that is poor and deprived of all human rights.

    Our generals and leaders, who leave no opportunity to spit fire on Pakistan for the slightest provocation, develop cold feet when it comes to China on any issue -- border, Tibet, human rights, business and trade. Of course, we hear it very often how China is India's rival. But it's a rival India desperately wants to emulate.

    Deep down in their hearts the Indian elite love China's system.
    Reason-For people obsessed with unchecked power and unlimited money and cronyism of the worst kind, China is the best country in the world. It's an ideal allaince of uncontrolled capitalism and political dictatorship. "Imagine a system where you can do whatever you want without going to the people every five years to get their approval in elections. Almost all Indian politcial parties would love to have a system like this in India."

    Note : Nothing personal to the elite on this forum who love china:)
    CommentQuote
  • Manish & Digvijay,

    I am not here to bash India, rather I am proud to be an Indian:). I am not saying there are no flaws in Chinese system, yes there are & I know well how people are thrown off the buildings & case closed as accidents. I have seen spy vids of these as well. There is huge info which I can go writing about the evils of China, coz I am active member of Friends Of Tibet ( visit it here :- http://www.friendsoftibet.org/ ).

    Human rights record is worse in China, but then think about a mango man who is interested in just 9-5 job without thinking about anything else (In India too, 80% people would of these kind). Their quality of life is better than their previous generation.

    China was trailing India till 1978, then as we had license raaj (thanks to crap Nehruvian policies implemented by Mrs.G), it spoilt the party & China overtook us from here. In 1940s, Shanghai was just small town running on dens, prostitution & drugs....see where it went in 55 yrs!!

    Japan was wiped off in WW2, see where it is now (it was the same time when we got Independence).

    Bottom-line is DEADLINE & VISION are missing here especially Govt. The road work gets delayed & cost is increased by 200% & many times this is done deliberately, classic eg. is Bandra-Worli sea link.

    Again in case of RE, see how many projects in China are sold based on DP roads. Hiranandani Powai is good, but it is done by private sector not public.

    I admit that India has huge potential & by several estimates, it is said that if the corruption in Govt. is reduced by 50%, we can overtake China in 3.5 yrs:bab (34):.

    Man, this issue started just because when some fellow members posted about US houses, they raised some objections not to compare US with India, hence came China.

    Chinese is over-built, India is under-built. Once we get good infra, development will take place, satellite cities will be created & more option for house seekers will be opened up, who knows the today's outskirts may well become the prime addresses 10 yrs down the line;). So, for now, before you buy RE see the long term Value than short term Price.
    CommentQuote
  • We have oligarchy in India, with noblest intentions was democracy started but how many educated people vote ( I do always)? Many people's names go missing from voter's list all of a sudden. People go on a trek, vacation on day of election.

    What kind of people stand up for election? Do we know them personally? Do we see them siting and walking among common people on street?

    Either many of them are super rich that fund party or otherwise they are goons, or have some kind of cheap communal local agenda.

    How many of us think before we vote, do we get what a person has done, can do and will do if elected? People just vote either Congress or BJP or relative/caste-connected etc etc,

    So anyway, China is ahead of us because they have open autocracy of one party(we have hidden oligarchy of few people), just look at what happened at Bihar Assembly - is this way democracy is to function?; here we have democracy where bunch of non-eligible candidates have reached high posts through some distortions and are wasting country's resources by exploiting democracy for their benefit, why - educated brainy people escape to USA for better jobs or are not interested in politics.
    CommentQuote
  • Well always its easy to blame politician. Even in developed countries people blame to politician for their so called misery. Our politicians are refection of our society.
    How many people pay taxes diligently and obey basic laws. How many of follow traffic rules? There are so many instances list goes on.. How that money is utilized is whole different question? We are so much worried about Chinese people but don’t we do same thing by exploiting kids in small tapari’s? We expect maids to be available and that to be with cheaper salary.

    I agree with Munish, we still prefer ‘saranjamshahi’ although we say we are democracy. How many people died in last few railway accidents? And railway minister is spending just 5-8 hours in a week for railway administrator. She is most worried about her political future in her home state. How ironic is that?
    Every month average 100 people die in local train incidents this is happening from also so many years? Does anybody care about it?
    We are ready to fight with our own people using military as we want their land for mining. In the name of development for few elites we want to sacrifice poor people. Government never cared about development of these areas with basic facilities but now they want pople to sacrifice their living sources for country.

    Problems and issues exist is every society in India we are worried about food and shelter and in developed countries they are worried about gay rights.

    Basic thing is we need to be proud of our country and everyone starting from ourselves should be doing right thing for our country.

    i know many forum member are doing great things, I have adored reals gesture of giving away prize money for great cause. How many people do those things.
    Rich people in our country just wants to become more rich. there are some instances but we need more

    Anyways enough of preaching even I need to be continue doing RIGHT things. :bab (2):
    CommentQuote
  • Dear Real comments in bold

    I am not here to bash India, rather I am proud to be an Indian:). I am not saying there are no flaws in Chinese system, yes there are & I know well how people are thrown off the buildings & case closed as accidents. I have seen spy vids of these as well. There is huge info which I can go writing about the evils of China, coz I am active member of Friends Of Tibet ( visit it here :- http://www.friendsoftibet.org/ ).

    Human rights record is worse in China, but then think about a mango man who is interested in just 9-5 job without thinking about anything else (In India too, 80% people would of these kind). Their quality of life is better than their previous generation.

    The quality is offcourse better than previous generation, but there is one generation who has paid the price. We can also have that with a dictator or communism, and I bet my friend all of us will despise it, incluging you. No body in this present world would like to be part of that generation which has lifted China so fast.

    China was trailing India till 1978, then as we had license raaj (thanks to crap Nehruvian policies implemented by Mrs.G), it spoilt the party & China overtook us from here. In 1940s, Shanghai was just small town running on dens, prostitution & drugs....see where it went in 55 yrs!!

    Chinese economy was opened up in 1978, while the Indian economy was opened up in 1991( due to extreme circumstance).
    We might not be just 13 years behind China, but we are definately not more than 25 years behind China.
    I also despise the Nehruvian policy.

    Japan was wiped off in WW2, see where it is now (it was the same time when we got Independence).

    Realacre the comparision is not right, the infrastructure of Japan was damaged in WW II, but we must remember they had strong industries during that time, there infrastructure was good, and they had world class companies going at that time, eg Mitsubishi group, Kwasaki group, Mitsui group etc.
    Japan attacked Pearl harbour with SIX AIRCRAFT CARRIERS. India still has only ONE AIRCRAFT CARRIER.
    So you can imagine the kind of industries that existed in Japan during that time, and all of them were not destroyed. In fact much of it remained as Japan surrendered ( except Heroshima and Nagasaki)

    I agree Japan as country has highest work devotion. There hard work is unparalled, but that is in their culture, not just government and politician entire country works hard.




    Bottom-line is DEADLINE & VISION are missing here especially Govt. The road work gets delayed & cost is increased by 200% & many times this is done deliberately, classic eg. is Bandra-Worli sea link.

    Again in case of RE, see how many projects in China are sold based on DP roads. Hiranandani Powai is good, but it is done by private sector not public.

    I see much private sector hands in delays caused, we have some very greedy buisness houses

    I admit that India has huge potential & by several estimates, it is said that if the corruption in Govt. is reduced by 50%, we can overtake China in 3.5 yrs:bab (34):.

    We also wish so and we have strong feeling it will be done.

    Man, this issue started just because when some fellow members posted about US houses, they raised some objections not to compare US with India, hence came China.

    Chinese is over-built, India is under-built. Once we get good infra, development will take place, satellite cities will be created & more option for house seekers will be opened up, who knows the today's outskirts may well become the prime addresses 10 yrs down the line;). So, for now, before you buy RE see the long term Value than short term Price.

    Completely agree with you on this.
    CommentQuote
  • NEHRU, BORN IN A BROTHEL?



    And Sword of Truth had publicly stated that Jawaharlal had
    died of syphilis(STD).

    My Gosh cannot believe it .... is it true ???

    I was browsing for Nehru and came across this ....
    Read it before the link is removed ;)


    http://newsgroups.derkeiler.com/Archive/Soc/soc.culture.indian/2005-11/msg00105.html
    CommentQuote
  • Hahaha does it matter NOW? Or even then!

    Hitler was a very great man personally and disciplined as compared to Winston Churchill or Roosevelt.

    But these people are known for values and ideology they harvested not whose sons and daughters they were or what do they in closed rooms

    Originally Posted by frugality
    NEHRU, BORN IN A BROTHEL?



    And Sword of Truth had publicly stated that Jawaharlal had
    died of syphilis(STD).

    My Gosh cannot believe it .... is it true ???

    I was browsing for Nehru and came across this ....
    Read it before the link is removed ;)


    http://newsgroups.derkeiler.com/Archive/Soc/soc.culture.indian/2005-11/msg00105.html
    CommentQuote
  • Farookh Abdullah ex-CM of Kashmir & current renewable power minister is the son of Nehru. Any guesses why Nehru's son is born Abdullah??

    Man, the entire Nehru family needs to do a DNA check, you will find all as mix-breed:D.

    * Sonia Maino Gandhi too is Nehru & not Gandhi.
    CommentQuote
  • Guys, stick with Real Estate discussion please. Pune RE scene is murky enough so as to not need additional spices to make it more stinky than it is!
    CommentQuote