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Offshoring to India will end in 8-10 years: Hackett report

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Offshoring to India will end in 8-10 years: Hackett report

Last updated: March 26 2012
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  • #51

    #51

    Re : Offshoring to India will end in 8-10 years: Hackett report

    No Sir. Not me.

    Originally posted by Jai_Singh View Post
    Are you planning to commit suicide tonight !!
    Originally posted by Jai_Singh View Post
    Are you planning to commit suicide tonight !!
    Me ? No sir. I am not that. I was only presenting a scenario based on my experience. And was expecting a decent counter argument.

    I did not know that you are one of those idiotic positive thinking class students.

    But from your reaction, you seem like one of those exasperated retards who has neither a clue nor an intention to understand. Please sir, get some help from a mental health professional before it is too late.

    Indian society is not very kind to retards these days. Patience ran out.

    [I am sorry dear Moderator. I had to take this idiot jai_singh down since you let his malicious post without moderating. This could have been filtered. I am here to exchange ideas not get insulted by some two dime prick]

    Comment

    • #52

      #52

      Re : Offshoring to India will end in 8-10 years: Hackett report

      Originally posted by chandra2034 View Post
      Meaning separate company for support project where no mind required.
      That's quite a "mindless" thing to say mate. There are profiles in support which are equally intriguing/challenging (IF NOT MORE), when compared to development work.

      I know mate, cause I am a Database Systems Admin (DBA if you will) and I have developers asking me all sort of "mind-less" questions about the systems all day long!

      Comment

      • #53

        #53

        Re : Offshoring to India will end in 8-10 years: Hackett report

        Originally posted by delhidwarka View Post
        software programmers in one of the top service bus technologies. in US u have to pay him 100k USD , here he is available for 6-8 lakhs per annum. and they work much better and much faster than their US peers.
        Yes, I agree 100%.
        And there is absolutely no difference in 6-8 lacs in NCR or Bangalore.
        In general, Bangalore always pays high for any job. That's the point I was coming to.
        Vikas Verma, www.HireFromCampus.com

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        • #54

          #54

          Re : Offshoring to India will end in 8-10 years: Hackett report

          Originally posted by gharondabhai View Post
          Do you think time difference is an advantage or a major disadvantage?
          Its an advantage for a particular business model. Here are couple advantages that I know:
          1. When it is their day, its our night and Vice verse. So, work is in continuation for 24 hours that way.
          2. There are some business process which if processed in their night(our day), gets discounted due to their non business hours.

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          • #55

            #55

            Re : Offshoring to India will end in 8-10 years: Hackett report

            Originally posted by ThePunjabi View Post
            Not every one who is working for a MNC has seen their salary increase by 10 times in last few years.

            An average call center guy was drawing Rs 8000 as starting salary in 2005 and someone starting at the same starting position now a days is drawing Rs 12K or 15K at best in better known companies like IBM Daksh. This call center guy is a major part of outsourcing industry. Here we are talking about outsourcing/offshoring industry and not the IT industry in particular. IT includes chip design as well.

            Your salary has increased because of the number of years that you have already put in. What about the current salary for the position where you joined say 5-10 years ago? I bet salary for that position has barely doubled in last say 7 years.
            I was one of those people who joined at 8000 at IBM daksh..but i knew there cant be much improvement in terms of salary over years...so i moved..

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            • #56

              #56

              Re : Offshoring to India will end in 8-10 years: Hackett report

              Originally posted by ashar_amu View Post
              Its an advantage for a particular business model. Here are couple advantages that I know:
              1. When it is their day, its our night and Vice verse. So, work is in continuation for 24 hours that way.
              2. There are some business process which if processed in their night(our day), gets discounted due to their non business hours.
              There is no single answer. However, advantage of US night is over blown out of proportion ... on the contrary, it is indeed a disadvantage for quality work.

              In general, back end jobs, which require very minimal human intervention/intelligence or interaction can be done during US night.

              However, most of the works that require constant 2-way communications can not be done in US night .. as your US counterpart will not change his/her schedule to accommodate you.

              So, to match US day, our people work in the night. Unfortunately, God made human body to work more efficiently during day time and performance degrades during night. So, practically, only low end jobs can be done in night, where scope of error is higher and skill required is lower. Call centre/BPO falls in this category.

              A highly skilled professional will never prefer to work during night, no matter how much salary you give to him. Whatever few lakhs extra you may earn now will be spend as your medical bills few days later or settling family disputes. People already understood this and not many senior people ever prefer a night job if they have any other viable alternate with slightly lesser pay package.

              The other issue with US night is, the Angrez will expect you to be there in your India office before he leaves his office in US in the evening ... and also expect you to be remain in office when he comes the next day morning ...

              The time arbitrage was over hyped by the outsourcing consultants but in reality that backfired ..)

              Comment

              • #57

                #57

                Re : Offshoring to India will end in 8-10 years: Hackett report

                Originally posted by Mikhail View Post
                Wholeheartedly agreed. For a short time, i was in the manhattan office of a major private equity firm.
                The US guys came in at 8:00 sharp. Took a big glass of juice and started work and got up.. at 12:30 to go for lunch. Back to work in half an hour.
                1 to 5 -- incredibly productive work with maybe just a 5 min break.
                At 5:05, bag slung across the shoulder, they left. Infact, if you looked down from one of the skyscrapers, you could see a swarm of people exiting multiple buildings.
                Compare that with what most of us did.
                Come in at 8:05. Take that big coffee and indulge in some pantry humour. Work/pretend to work for some time.
                Call up loved ones in India from the office phone, indulge in some banter every 1.5 hours. Take that big lunch at the $5 rajma chawal cart. Loiter around more than necessary. Then, stretch that work beyond 6 pm and cry "Onsite mei maar rakhi hai yaar- saale khud toh 5 bajey nikal jaate hai"
                Heck! my lead used to steal the carton milk from the pantry.

                We lack professionalism - big time. Most guys are in IT just because it pays decent without really being back breaking work. Hardly anyone seems to love what he is doing.

                My take on the report findings. There will definitely be a shakedown. The slowest and the escapists will be let go. But, people who love what they do, will always find a way in IT

                On a lighter note:: gotta prod the HR guys. 1st April is coming up. Its H1B visa time My solution to the big fat EMI i am paying.
                Where r u Bro? long time no C?

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                • #58

                  #58

                  Re : Offshoring to India will end in 8-10 years: Hackett report

                  The challanges that are being faced by the IT/ITES/BPO companies are not indeginious rather theu are global. The world economy is not

                  In the several post i've seen the point of rising salaries, quality and efficiency has been raised but believe me fellows these are not the problems which cant be tackeled. The problems are being faced around the globe in todays time and have are not indigenous.

                  There are several ways to reduce cost of business like
                  1. Allow work from home or atleast allow people to stay at home when they are not required in office. I read a survey/study done by cisco which revealed that most of the employee think that coming to office is not required and they are ready to work for lower salaries if give a chance to work from home.
                  2. As for training...impart training in the tier-2 cities like meerut,chd,jaipur etc.
                  3. Many of us who have worked in corporate sector would know that companies are ready to hire a new person from another company for twice the salary but would not give own employee 10% salary hike and bigger responsibilty.

                  4. As for the US guys working efficiently....Well....Give your employee the right to leave sharp at 5pm and DUTY to complete the task on time. You will see the wonders it can do. People kill time in office cos they know that if they complete the work in hand by 5pm then some more work would be given to be done by 9PM. So why work efficiently.....
                  As i said earlier that companies do not giving salary hikes to their employees on the basis of individual performace and capabilities but on the basis of herd performance. Hence the smart employees know that next salary hike would come from JOB SWITCH and not from working hard and efficiently. So what they do....they just learn new skills for sixth months update CV and wait for right oppertunity and work like any one else.

                  5. have you guys seen infy,IBM,TCS,Wipro hiring "Technical" freshers for high salary No. these companies have guts to go to IITs and offer a package of 4LPA. Can you believe it.
                  Point i'm try to make is that htese compnanies are getting what they pay. They are not hiring smart and creative people cause they want to continue to do run of the mill jon and not the product developement which requirs different kind of mindset and resources.

                  Now the crux of the matter is that do i believe that above points are so special that none of the indian MNC think about...Answer is "A BIG NO". point is that Indian companies need not to apply above point coz the problesm it would solve are not "actually" the problems they are facing. Thats why i said in the beginning of my post that rising cost of business, emploee efficiency etc are not the issues faced by industries and my post was to support this point only.

                  Comment

                  • #59

                    #59

                    Re : Offshoring to India will end in 8-10 years: Hackett report

                    Originally posted by chandra2034 View Post
                    .......

                    No danger to offshoring work. By 2020, India will have 20 more cities with 24x7 power supply and super fast network connectivity.

                    And a major part of medical cost /screening/testing samples etc will offshore to India.

                    Remember, India is not a country who invent something, it's a country which implement something.

                    In another 5-6 years, companies will divide divisions based on work and talent.

                    Meaning separate company for support project where no mind required.

                    India has reached where in IT where no competion for another 20 years so relax.

                    IT is still limited to 5% of Indian life, so 95% still need to be tapped.
                    Which 20 cities will have 24x7 power supply and super-fast connectivity in just another 8 years?
                    BTW, Which city in India NOW has 24x7 power and connectivity comparable to top 10% in world?
                    Forget developed world, Which city in India matches China's top cities in terms of infrastructure? What happened to Mumbai as Shanghai?

                    Its good to be optimistic but the bitter reality is that we have goofed up big time and missed the golden opportunity.

                    Don't go by emotions; go by facts on the table.
                    'LIVE FOR INDIA'

                    Comment

                    • #60

                      #60

                      Re : Offshoring to India will end in 8-10 years: Hackett report

                      lol

                      Originally posted by Jai_Singh View Post
                      The challanges that are being faced by the IT/ITES/BPO companies are not indeginious rather theu are global. The world economy is not

                      In the several post i've seen the point of rising salaries, quality and efficiency has been raised but believe me fellows these are not the problems which cant be tackeled. The problems are being faced around the globe in todays time and have are not indigenous.

                      There are several ways to reduce cost of business like
                      1. Allow work from home or atleast allow people to stay at home when they are not required in office. I read a survey/study done by cisco which revealed that most of the employee think that coming to office is not required and they are ready to work for lower salaries if give a chance to work from home.
                      2. As for training...impart training in the tier-2 cities like meerut,chd,jaipur etc.

                      3. Many of us who have worked in corporate sector would know that companies are ready to hire a new person from another company for twice the salary but would not give own employee 10% salary hike and bigger responsibilty.

                      4. As for the US guys working efficiently....Well....Give your employee the right to leave sharp at 5pm and DUTY to complete the task on time. You will see the wonders it can do. People kill time in office cos they know that if they complete the work in hand by 5pm then some more work would be given to be done by 9PM. So why work efficiently.....
                      As i said earlier that companies do not giving salary hikes to their employees on the basis of individual performace and capabilities but on the basis of herd performance. Hence the smart employees know that next salary hike would come from JOB SWITCH and not from working hard and efficiently. So what they do....they just learn new skills for sixth months update CV and wait for right oppertunity and work like any one else.

                      5. have you guys seen infy,IBM,TCS,Wipro hiring "Technical" freshers for high salary No. these companies have guts to go to IITs and offer a package of 4LPA. Can you believe it.
                      Point i'm try to make is that htese compnanies are getting what they pay. They are not hiring smart and creative people cause they want to continue to do run of the mill jon and not the product developement which requirs different kind of mindset and resources.

                      Now the crux of the matter is that do i believe that above points are so special that none of the indian MNC think about...Answer is "A BIG NO". point is that Indian companies need not to apply above point coz the problesm it would solve are not "actually" the problems they are facing. Thats why i said in the beginning of my post that rising cost of business, emploee efficiency etc are not the issues faced by industries and my post was to support this point only.


                      You talk like some sort of motivation speaker. lol.

                      The IT is NOT a global problem. It is INDIAN , ASIAN problem. This is why. We are like parasites. Period. Living on outsourcing. We call jajjy names like 'solution provider', 'facilitator ' , 'customer engagement manager' etc, but at the end of the day . Its body shopping. You are hired cos you cost less to the company. Period. You , in IT is no different than a person working in a construction company where the contractor charges the builder by hour. In IT or ITES or SAAS or whichever realm, the same model. per hour rate of programmer 30$ etc. We do not have ONE product worth it's salt ( I am not talking about proprietary ones like Bancs of TCS etc) which is universallu accepted.

                      SO , the crux here is , you are paid some 40K cos company charges the customer 90 K and the customer gets it done for 90K whereas he could have incurred 300 K. Simple logic.

                      Coming to why it is not a global phenomenon. US and Europe are consumers of IT services. Asia ( Indian , China, Philippines and Taiwan) are producers of the service.

                      As a result economic woos, the US , Europe are (a) Cutting down their consumption ( postponing IT spending) or (b) Locally hiring. So , the body shopping capacity of India diminished over the last 5 years. besides, there is competition from other countries like Philippines , China even Russia and Vietnam, Hong Kong , Singapore , Thailand, Malaysia , Srilanka .

                      All the mentioned countries offer much less rates than India.

                      For example, hiring an Indian IT pro costs company at entry level costs about 4 lacs/ annum for that amount I can hire 2 Taiwanese programmers, much better quality and part time. . Check rates. if it is Philippines, I can hire 3 software programmers.

                      Why this happened ? because of greed in India without scruples.

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